Arcata Vets Ask City Council to Remove Earth Flag From Top of Plaza Flagpole
Plaza flags with the Earth flag on top. [Photo provided by Measure M initiative supporters]
A contingent of veterans representing American Legion Post 274 in Arcata last week addressed the City Council, asking it to set aside the outcome of last November’s election regarding Measure M.
The Put The Earth On Top initiative, sponsored by activist Dave Meserve and passed by Arcata voters, requires the City of Arcata to fly the Earth flag topmost on its flagpoles, above the U.S. and State of California flags.
In a letter presented to the council (see page 7 of this week’s Mad River Union), the veterans say members of Post 274 were “offended and downright angry” at Measure M’s passage. They consider it an inappropriate use of the Plaza’s Veterans Memorial Flagpole, erected in 1957 to honor those who served in the U.S. military.
The Stars & Stripes, its proper display and respectful treatment, is a matter of intense and continuing interest within the culture of the American Legion. Post 274’s members think Arcata voters made a mistake stemming from ignorance in approving Measure M and demoting Old Glory.
“We respect the will of the people. We served for the will of the people. However, we believe Arcata’s voters were unaware this flagpole was a Veteran’s [sic] Memorial,” reads the letter, signed by Post Commander Jeffrey Sterling and Post Finance Officer/Adjutant Phillip Nicklas. “Measure M passed by a slim margin, and we doubt it would have passed if the flagpole’s status as a Memorial had been common knowledge.”
The letter offers a compromise for what it calls the “World Flag.”
“If the city of Arcata wanted to construct another flagpole on the plaza to display the World Flag, we would be happy to support that,” states the letter. “But our members purposefully dedicated that flagpole to honor all United States Veterans. And they believe it should continue to serve this purpose. So we, the members of…the American Legion Arcata Post 274 respectfully ask the City Council to fly the United States Flag at the top of the Veteran’s [sic] Memorial flagpole again. Thank you.”
Having been raised during Early Oral Communications, the flag matter wasn’t on the council’s agenda, and it took no action. Nor did any councilmembers opine on the vets’ issue.
City Councilmember Stacy Atkins-Salazar, who served as mayor when the Put the Flag On Top, noted only that the legality of the measure, which was heavily questioned by opponents, is currently under review.
Contacted later, Nicklas offered context on Legion Post 274’s letter. He’s aware of the seeming contradiction in having served to protect democracy, but wishing to reverse the decision of Arcata voters, but notes that the exception would only apply to the Plaza flagpole.
“We don’t want them to overturn the election,” Nicklas said, adding that the letter may have been “sloppy” in making clear Post 274’s wishes. “We don’t want to go against the will of the people.”
As a City Council candidate last November, Post 274 Commander Sterling didn’t mention the flag matter as a concern during a pre-election interview with the Union.
“I think everyone assumed that the U.S. flag would be on top of a Veterans’ Memorial Flagpole,” Nicklas said. Had that been clear, he said, “we don’t think [Measure M] would have passed.”
As to why the vets object to the Earth flag, Nicklas said it’s only a matter of placement. “The Earth flag does not disrespect us veterans. It simply doesn’t honor them. And that flagpole was dedicated to veterans,” he said.
As for the letter’s “World Flag” (vs. Earth flag) reference, Nicklas said that was just an accident.
While Nicklas blamed the passage of Measure M on lack of information, speaker Ken Vanderplas said it was more a problem with voter intelligence.
“You’d have to be a moron if you think this is not disrespectful to our state and nation,” he said of Measure M. “Who doesn’t want a clean Earth? This is not the way to deal with that subject.”
Measure M was approved by 3.051 (52.31 percent) of Arcata’s voters. Those voting against the measure totaled 2.781 (47.69 percent).
Nicklas hopes raising the issue will help educate the public. “I see it as an opportunity to let Arcata know that the flagpole is a veterans’ memorial,” he said.
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Kinda late to the game, guys! You had your chance to make your arguments against the flag matter. If you did, you were unsuccessful. If you did not, you can decide among yourselves how that happened. Also, there are of course, vets who support the Earth flag on top.
I want to suggest that your attachment to the US flag as most important is old school thinking. We have recently learned and need to remind people, even in subtle ways like putting the Earth flag on top, that in this time of worldwide climate danger to people, places, animals and cultures, we must regard the Earth as the highest of our priorities!
If all else fails, it seems you guys will need to put your own initiative together to change the use of the Plaza flag pole to your liking.
I do appreciate that your tone is not anti-Earth flag. That can allow a reasonable conversation to take place.
BTW. What was the position of your vets group with removing the McKinley statue? Were you aligned with that vote to do so? Or did your group also oppose moving it?
You’re welcome for the freedom to attack others that veterans protected for you.
I can empathize with Vets on this. However, voters had their say.
” …. more a problem with voter intelligence. “
Exactly. Arcata is a moron’s paradise. They don’t care who they insult in their quest for…hmmm…not really sure what they are doing anymore over there…posing for peace?
Arcata has a few more (major) problems than this… probably next on the agenda though…where should we put another roundabout! Brilliant!
Zero Leadership!
Ignorance is bliss
Once again Arcata goes full goose bozo.
How about install a taller pole for just the American flag keep the others on the existing pole!
…or get a re-vote and have Jeff lead an awareness campaign!
Thank you to the Vets that fought for my freedom. My Dad is a Vietnam vet.
I personally don’t think this is cool either but there’s no need to get salty about this, Mike.
“Jesus said, ‘be salt, and light’, not salty and lit!”
That was hardly an attack
That’s an old trope that is not based in reality.
No country has ever tried to take our freedom. Our sovereignty has never been threatened.
You may want to do a search of what is currently going on with the WHO treaty. Think again about our sovereignty being threatened.
That WHO story has been debunked numerous times. They will have no control over US sovereignty
From the WHO website “The treaty would also state that the health of humans, animals and the planet are all connected and should lead to shared responsibility, transparency and cooperation globally.”
Global cooperation!? God forbid!
Nailed it! Ha!
And where is there global cooperation on the horizon? In Ukraine? In TIbet? In the Middle East? In Ethiopia, Nigeria, Papua New Guinea? In Afghanistan? In Humboldt County? On the road you live? Even in the comment section of one small website? Maybe you need to think a bit more deeply about what cooperation means and what you personally are willing sacrifice to get it when a good section of the population thinks Arcata has a bunch of idiots pushing a personal offensive agenda. Try a little personal cooperation before you proceed to the whole world.
How might you forge a path to cooperation?
Cooperation with whom over what? Flying a flag is not cooperation. It is rhetoric. Cooperation comes two ways- one through recognition of shared needs and the other through intimidation. One government entity using its power to demand to be heard about social values pretty much fits in the latter. And like most intimidation, it will only fester with dissent.
You want cooperation, then everyone needs to have a share the benefits and a share of the liabilities. So make environmental positive more attractive. And fund it from taxing the liabilities. Make efficient thing less expensive than inefficiency. Import cheap goods with a wasteful, damaging foot print? They are much more expensive. That’s a start.
I think I did offer to cooperate in my original message when I said “I do appreciate that your tone is not anti-Earth flag. That can allow a reasonable conversation to take place”. But you may have disregarded that.
Regarding WHO and their want for ‘cooperation’, it may be easier for organizations to cooperate as they have some rules of decorum that can prevent hotheads from ruining the opportunities for agreements. Certainly Ken Vanderplas does not lead the way to cooperation by calling people “morons”.
That sounds like an elaborate passive aggression-“I forgive you for being ignorant.” What wouldn’t be so aggressive is to say “Our country as represent by its flag has given me a lot of good and I respect it by not trying to top in its home with my personal opinion. So how can we increase our understanding of our place in the world without trying to diminish our country.?” The “our” part goes a long way and it’s totally absent from your remarks.
Our sovereignty. God forbid! That is what this article and the comments are about it. Guess you are into digital currency that includes a social credit score just in case you do not cooperate with a world order?
Oh really? Missed WWII for some reason? Japan bombed Hawaii. And lobbed a few at California. And sent incendiaries over the West Coast. And then there was the War of 1812. And you must believe that there are no state sponsored cyber attacks nor terrorists either. I used to watch Soviet era spy ship go back and forth just outside the US controlled waters off Cape Canaveral. And there are no PRC spies in US businesses and research facilities.
I tried to edit my comment to include the War of 1812 but Kym runs a pretty tight ship in that regard. ‘Course, that was over 200 years ago so it hardly seems relevant. None of the other things you mentioned come anywhere close to having threatened the soverignty of the US or the freedom of its citizens.
History is never relevant, crack me up. Why go to school?
One of the good reasons are that it helps prevent people from making ridiculous comments like, ‘Veterans fought and died to protect our freedom,’ and, “it’s a Federal Law you cannot fly any flag over the Stars and Stripe (sic).”
Crack me up.
Look up the word ” opinion”. It is not a synonym for history.
To learn that Hawaii wasn’t a State yet, and Pearl Harbor was a military installation. Also maybe to apply critical thinking skills to the fact that the attack, much more real and significant than the WHO suggesting nations cooperate, still didn’t come close to affecting our sovereignty.
If you stretch your rationalizations one more millimeter, it’s going to explode your brain.
Yeah, and Trump-inspired MAGA Republican hooligans did not attack the U.S. Capitol to overthrow a free and fair election and then got Republicans to vote against certifying that very election, on and on . . . . That never happened. Just another tourist day.
When in a quandary about how to force people to agree with you, throw Thump at them. That has nothing to do with sovereignty unless you believe Trump and his supporters were influenced by foreign misinformation. And frankly I would suspect some were from the constant repetition of divisive rhetoric here. But I also suspect the same is going on in the left’s agenda media too. Tools are tools and the BS shovel works ambidextrously.
Are there still veterans alive from WW2? That’s the last time the US military was used to protect the freedom of Americans.
Yes, my father is 98 and still living. He was in Germany for the last months of the European war. Germany was “pounded to dust” as Churchill said. He saw Dauchu with prisoners still on the grounds. You can thank a veteran that none of that happened here.
That idea depends on the interpretation of freedom. And what threatens it. I think 9/11 was a threat to freedom here. I think Chinese and Saudi nationals buying farm land is a threat to freedom. I think Somalia pirates are, spy satellites are, taking political hostages like Griner are, flooding markets with cheap and/or dangerous goods are, drug cartels are, invasive animals, insects and diseases are, etc. The worst danger is the utter stupidity of those who see themselves as invulnerable only because others are protecting them and they don’t notice.0
Yes.
George Mullins, from Garberville, CA, is one of them…
To interpret Ben Round’s statement as an attack on Vets
is hard to understand.
Well, veterans are “unassailable”. When I say”VET!”
You say”Sorry”
See how it works? I won.
Like the use of the word racism? Or empathy? Or Trump? Homeless? There a lot of people who think there are a lot of magical words that once mentioned defeat all opposition.
But there are people whose service gives them extra value in the discussion. Like mothers when debating children, doctors when debating illness and fire fighters when talking wildfires. Frankly, in a debate over flying the country’s flag, the people who have already served the country do have a greater right to be heard with respect than those who have not. See how it really works? Those who pay the piper call the tune.
Well, in Arcata, there is no federal law which applies to anything at all…
The voters said “Screw the law, screw the veterans, we’re gonna do what we want”…
This is how local governments waste resources, waste their time, and then enact stupid and illegal policies, until somebody sues…
I suggest that we bring in Federal Troops to change the flags, and, Arcata is welcome to fly the flag of Jamaica for all I care, as long as it’s on a separate pole.
It is already obvious that Humboldt County has no respect for Veterans, Federal Law or much of anything else, including itself…
One more reason not to send your kids to CPH.
Humans will leave this planet an empty stone, and flying an Earth First flag probably won’t change anything…
Heck PoM, I would think you would want ‘BIG government off our backs’. So this is a case where local people had some autonomy and used it to what they wanted, without harm to humans, but possibly to some peoples’ values.
“…bring in Federal Troops”. Really? Careful what you wish for, and to setting that precedent!
And hey. This “waste of resources”, while in the eye of the beholder, is a result of citizens having access to putting initiatives on the ballot for their fellow citizens to vote on. Are you actually against that opportunity?
Gosh, Ben, about half of what I wrote was purely incendiary for a reason…
“Big Government” just throws away the money we make and pay in taxes, all our politicians are on the grift, and the population of the USA gets stupider by the year…
I am frequently unsure that anyone, anywhere has enough individual power to accomplish anything, but when somebody, like the former Mayor of Arcata ends up getting a “buddy job” like Head of HCDHS, with no qualifications besides a Bachelor’s in Communications, you see the cause of ineffective government…
As for the People’s Republic of Arcata, you can’t call ignorant hicks “Hippies”, because “Hippies” had some self-respect, and were bonafide counterculturists, who didn’t give a fuck what flag went where because flags are a symbol of what we want to escape!
It’s all just absurd, but I once saw a community vote 85% yes to sell a hospital to a well documented con-artist who I saw through in 30 seconds…
Don’t take everything so seriously, and I spent my life taking my profits here and there, without a plan to get rich slowly or any other way…
Life is short, and pretty ridiculous, and the folks who love Arcata so much should spend a few years in Davis, which was destroyed by a bullying University steamrolling the townspeople, most of whom actually worked for or benefited directly from the University…
Your town will change, and you won’t recognize it if you don’t wise up and unify…
Stupid and futile gestures like changing the “flag order” are very laughable, and certain to offend…
If citizens are going to put up an initiative to reinstate slavery or remove the franchise of women, you going think that is just an “opportunity” too? Just admit it’s a solipsism and let it go. Democracy is always subject to mob rule and why most popular revolutions end up on tyrany. Democracy has its benefits but only in conjunction with republican values.
“It is rather for us to be here dedicated to the great task remaining before us—that from these honored dead we take increased devotion to that cause for which they gave the last full measure of devotion—that we here highly resolve that these dead shall not have died in vain—that this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom—and that government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth.” And that quote should not need attribution.
Not George Carlin, I’m guessing.
did you serve?
Yes, permanently serves as a constant reminder about why they are but hurt they had to move to lake county from beautiful Humboldt county. Constantly chiming in on threads bashing Humboldt and Cal Poly clearly has a undertone of jealousy.
No. Just missed the draft. Have done lots of public/ community service (by my initiative) though. I consider that to have been, and is now, much more beneficial to this country/culture.
I think one of our differences is that we see the flag from different points of view.
Cut that stupid earth flag down, and just fly the other two. NO flag flies above the American flag. Idiots.
So… Can we still fly the earth flag on the other poles? Is that fine?
It’s just this one pole, right folks? I mean… Isn’t it? I’m pretty sure he said that the other poles were fine… Just not clearly, or in the initial letter. Plus they are still convinced the community’s knowledge of that single pole would sway their vote about all of the other poles.
Which is, you know, okay. I get it. That’s your pole. And you don’t want anyone touching your pole. That’s fine. Leave that one the way it was.
There are other flag poles in town… Tbh the one at city hall feels more important to me. What government is this government building working for? And I think it shows that we as a community value the entire planet and not just our own little corner of the bay. But then I’m a pretty big moron, so you better not trust me 😛
You’re welcome for the freedom to be a moron that veterans protected for you.
Poor Mike
Sounds like PTSD
There is treatment
I’m pretty sure that we are not supposed to make direct personal insults on this forum.
i would say “moron” is for thinking you ever protected anyone’s freedom by joining a government controlled “service”. uninformed i would say you were.
Pushing it into the personal. I see the point you are trying to make but don’t go to personal again or you’ll end up in moderation.
I’m with the vets on this!
Me, too…!!!
Me too!
When did Vets become a monolith?
You misrepresent how varied vets’ thinking can be.
The Earth flag is NOT anti-vet.
Hello! Flags represent a country. They are required to be displayed in Government offices to show it is a place of that government. Others fly it to show respect for belonging to that entity.
A world flag is not itself anti‐vet. But requiring it to displace the flag of the country is. It is the voters of Arcata who, blinded by their lovely theories, were disrespectful.
Perfect response. Thank you!
But flying it above the country’s is. On any government building. It helps to understand that a flag is not a testimonial. It is an identity. Then people who don’t understand that would not be so confused. The people who want to fly a world flag above the country’s are just wrapping themselves in another flag while they complaining about those who do that with the American flag.
Look it up it’s a Federal Law you cannot fly any flag over the Stars and Stripe very disrespectful City of Arcata.
Thank you…
Any Boy Scout knows this…
I don’t think anybody wanted this to be intentionally disrespectful to Vets. I really don’t care either way, so if these Veterans are upset by it, then fine, move the Earth flag to a lower position. It’s just fabric flapping. There is a certain Feng Shui the Earthflag being at the lowest position. Gravity and all. Maybe the Earth flag enthusiasts can demonstrate they are easy going, and good natured, and not hung up too much on symbolism…or have the Arcata Veterans exclusively, vote on it. That might be interesting.
Of course THEY did. The whole point was to disrespect everyone who thought that honoring their own country was important. They thought that love or even respect for the US is a right wing stupidity THEY needed to fix by pointing out the country is only part of the world. Comes from always spouting off about the evils in their own country while being bythely unaware of its good provided to them. They are after all so special and enlightened. Comes of living in a microcosm of youth and entitlement.
And the harder reality that the who rest of the world doesn’t know or care what they think much less is willing to risk anything for their benefit as their fellow countrymen do. Hello! Arcata’s importance is smaller than the world, the country, the State and the county. Except in its outsized arrogant idea that does not need to respect the people who ensure its existence.
It’s not an enforceable law.
Case law has established the flag code as merely advisory.
https://crsreports.congress.gov/product/pdf/R/R45945#:~:text=The%20%E2%80%9Cflag%20code%E2%80%9D%20is%20the,where%20such%20display%20should%20occur.
Except for US and State government entities, which do have enforceable regulations. However this is a display why there is so much arrogance in people. There is a constant adolescent rebellion going on in social agendas equivalent to the teen saying “you can’t make me” over things that are simple courtesy when in fact it is only because adults with better perspectives that allows such self centeredness to act out. No one should push their agenda to the point someone will lose that perspective and actually do something about it. That goes for right and left equally.
Why is it taking so long for the city to review the legality of this?
The earth cannot be represented by a flag unless you subscribe to the flat earth theory.
Put a globe on top of the flag pole and make everyone happy.
Best idea presented here.
This veteran says “Earth First!”.
The city should consider the request and move the Earth flag. The pole is a veteran’s memorial. Vets around here are very likely into conservation of the earth but they did fight and die over the American flag. It isn’t the same thing and that is a valid point.
Someday, we might have “earth’ veterans who fought and died protecting the earth from space aliens and ufos. But we should not get ahead of ourselves.
Protecting the earth from balloons.
Honor the vote.
The pow/mia flag should get the top spot. Let us honor the real heros who made it possible for us too argue about crap like this. I always give what i have on me too the homeless vet guy with the sign on the corner. We should do a better job of taking care of these heros.
Are you sure he is a Vet? Yes there are some that claim they are and never served or were dishonorably discharged.
Typical self created Arcata liberal hippie problem. Problem is, me don’t see the Arcata liberal hippie sect saying a peep currently about our country sticking our nose in the Russia/Ukraine trough except keep sucking down more bullets for bullion. Guess some wars are good! Yippeee! Similarly, in the push for all electric, I guess the Arcata liberal hippie sect also doesn’t mind destroying the Earth, hence the push for giant bird choppers, whale sonar interrupters, and deforestation of rainforests in the Congo for Cobalt. Guess some environmental destruction is great. Hee hawwwww! Forget the humans, especially the Arcata liberal hippie sect, as they are idiots. Save the albatrosses, whales and primates!
Do what you want, but don’t throw the baby out with the bathwater, just because you don’t like the current Executive! You are going to want to adopt SOME new technologies here and there. A decision to switch from horse and buggy to automobiles, or sails to diesel, can be a non partisan one. Ask yourself ( and it’s safe to answer slowly, and in private, to yourself…) If you would be so outraged by wind mills if Russiaphile L’Orange could still hit a golf ball with the blades spinning in the distance?
You first… I mean about asking yourself and noticing the absence of those babies you’ve already thrown out. How can a rational person complain someone else is mindlessly rejecting good just because they don’t like the current Executive while exhibiting their own desire to do the same over someone who has left the office? (BTW the word is actually russophile)
You know who I refer to as Russiaphile L’Orange? (Pronounced: “Russia pile”)
So thinks “ph”is pronounced like a “p” too.
So thinks I’m getting all bent over this too.
Amusing were it not so tragic, the anti-war hippies of the sixties are the warmongers of today. Where’s code pink? Where are the leftist priests pouring red paint over their bodies, where are streets filled with protesters? Oh that’s right, this conflict covers up the financial shenanigans and money laundering the democrats have engaged in since they orchestrated the Maidan massacre and overthrow of an elected President in 2014 (thank you Victoria Nuland, Hillary Clinton, Susan Powers and the rest of the good ole gals in the Obama state dept.). Oh yeah, the people of the Donbass region want to thank these they creatures for allowing, alas supporting, the 8 years of bombardment of their infrastructure by the Ukrainians. Now ask yourself this question; what would be our response if Russia and its Allies were to set up shop in Mexico or Canada? Hmmm
I praise God AND honor our flag. Now who’s gonna go collect all the homeless vets freezing out in the elements this early freezing morning?
is there an emergency winter storm shelter for people??? I haven’t read of anything.
https://kymkemp.com/2023/02/21/winter-storm-bringing-snow-cold-and-hazardous-conditions-warns-humboldt-county-office-of-emergency-services/
The hours of operation are pathetic, I’ll admit. But, as you may have noticed, every time there is a proposal to do something about the houseless issue, people gripe up and down that it’s not the government’s job to fix it.
Why not just pray for warm weather? Or did Satan make it cold?
If the county had kept their agreement to maintain the Vet’s Hall in Garberville, we could likely have that open to people to give them shelter. But NOOOOO! They let it knowingly deteriorate and have had it closed for over 5 years!
BTW, I feel like thanking our vets this morning. Why wait until Veterans Day?
(?❄️❄️❄️If anyone knows WHERE they can FIND SHELTER from the elements this morning please SAY SO!!!)
THANK YOU VETS! I have had freedom all my life here in these United States. I just wish I would have put it to better use. Forgive me for that. ?.
Let the memorial flagpole be just that…a memorial. To our vets.
Let the cross be a memorial and testament to Christ. If people start hanging other things besides His robe and crown of thorns, or INRI signs, I’ma be mad! And I’m gonna say something!
Don’t mess with the Veterans flagpole!!!
I agree, enough. Be wary of priestly money changers using His Name to re-appropriate you savings on Sunday too! Jesus of Nazareth wasn’t an American, we should be cautious associating the Lord’s Name with something as risky as blind patriotism, and focus on the PEOPLE who sacrificed.
Also remember: if you get worked up about the American Flag being disrespected by the Earth flag, then the Confederate Stars and Bars, is a definite no-go. That was a flag that is every bit anti America, and pro insurrection, pro rebellion, and based on a very anti (Jesus of Nazareth) Christian dependency on slave labor, and concentrated wealth.
https://lostcoastoutpost.com/2023/feb/22/need-shelter-many-extreme-weather-shelters-have-op/
❄️♥️❄️
Thank you for re-posting that here!
I wonder what’s available in Mendocino County? Anybody know? There’s nothing posted on MendoFever as of a few hours ago.
I contacted my family member asking if they saw any houseless on the streets in Ukiah. Yes, at Walmart, there was a person or persons under a tarp.
In today’s society, to be politically correct, the American flag should be flown upside-down with a white flag of surrender flown over it.
There seems to be no end of ways to be offensive. Although I am solidly for protecting the environment, the American Flag is a different issue. I have good friends that have fought for, and also died for our country with the American Flag on their shoulder. That should be respected for what it is. Anything less is extremely disrespectful.
If the people of Arcata voted for the Earth Flag and want it to be their flag, They deserve it. I know “War is Bad”, but the far sighted can clearly see the alternative.
My Father, Army, my Uncle, Air Force, Grandfather, Navy, and BIL and SIL, both Army, served this country in times of war and peace and I am grateful. However I have zero respect for our government at this time. Seems that the people voted to fly the Earth flag, and so it flies. To put the government flag above all else is not cool with me. The US Flag does not represent me as an individual, and I feel shame that it is flown knowing all of the things our government does to its citizens and to other countries. I have no pride for that flag…
So if they had voted to reinstate slavery, that would be a go with you too? Or would that be one of the things you were so ashamed of the US doing? Or simply acknowledge that voting is not the same thing doing right?
Twisted
I respect your family and your opinion. The flag does not represent our government as it is. To me the flag represents what America should and can be, which most will agree it is not.
I think our measure has been taken, and we have fallen short.
“the flag represents what America should and can be”
Thanks Ernie! I completely agree. It represents our aspirations. We have a history of making positive changes and a beautiful framework to allow them.
Kind of like how the people that voted for Biden are getting what they deserve for voting for a brain dead career criminal?
Who is happy with our current conditions, anybody?
Oh quit it. This has nothing to do with the current President. Does this comment have anything to not letting any crisis go to waste too.
Two men in a room: Joe Biden, and Donald Trump. One t shirt that says “Brain dead career criminal” which one wears it best? How did all the wonderful things Trump did for us get undone so quickly? It can’t be that there’s a certain continuity in life, where some actions have consequences that take longer than a week to play out. Besides, isn’t Trump still the president, grudgingly allowing Biden to pretend to be a shadow president, while trump pretends not to be president, while actually leading the Nation, but slyly forcing Biden to take the Blame…but why would Trump be campaigning? Fundraising? Because Biden’s a criminal, and Trump’s a star businessman. Biden doesn’t have steaks or ties, or branded water to sell to disaster relief operations! Nothing will be settled until we get to see Hunter’s nudes. Given the significance of the LAPTOP to the Nation,the photos will be made into a flag, and will fly in-between the State flag, County flag, Arcata flag, the Plaza flag, alongside the in home healthcare workers, memorial flagpole, the hospitality workers flagpole, the therapist flagpole, the engineering consultants’ flagpole. The Earthflag will move to the astronomy undergrad memorial pole, and definitely fly below the Solar System flag, and the Universe flag.
The Jedi Knight approve of that comment.
It’s a shame what Arcata has become
Factoid!
Pine for the days when homeless prospectors disembarked from a swampy pier, pooped in outhouses, before leaving to kill locals and take their land.
Across the southern border?
lol
First and foremost this only goes to show how low voters iq exactly is in arcata these days.
But the kicker is how dumb city council must be collectively. I mean summer them a door knob.
Besides it being completely unconstitutional this pole ist simply not on the list where voting over it would come into play.
it sounds like the whole town had had multiple booster shots
I consider it disrespectful to fly a flag above the US flag. In my opinion only one flag should be flown on a pole. How about separate poles?
How is is disrespectful to put our planet before our nation?
It wouldn’t be if there was a Army of the World willing to put life and limb at risk to defend US citizens. But since that is only in comic books, and patriotism for the country is the motivation for veterans in the real world, it is insulting to put a flag for which no one has risked anything above the one for which some have risked much on any government entity. .
Uscode.house.gov
4 USC Ch. 1: The Flag
7(c) No other flag or pennant should be placed above or, if on the same level, to the right of the flag of the United States of America, except during church services conducted by naval chaplains at sea, when the church pennant may be flown above the flag during church services for the personnel of the Navy. No person shall display the flag of the United Nations or any other national or international flag equal, above, or in a position of superior prominence or honor to, or in place of, the flag of the United States at any place within the United States or any Territory or possession thereof: Provided, That nothing in this section shall make unlawful the continuance of the practice heretofore followed of displaying the flag of the United Nations in a position of superior prominence or honor, and other national flags in positions of equal prominence or honor, with that of the flag of the United States at the headquarters of the United Nations.
You referenced a non legally-binding code. The constitution trumps the Flag Code:
Street v. New York
Spence v. Washington
Texas v. Johnson
United States v. Eichman
What? Veterans don’t live on earth?
They aren’t veterans of any world army anyway. They can fly most any flag they want but only are due honor from those they actually served. I expect they would want to honor their compatriots more than any fictitious entity.
I don’t live in Arcata, thank God, but I would never have voted for any flag to fly above the American flag. My husband served in Viet Nam and I would never disgrace him or anyone else who served. You guys that want to fly and honor the earth flag put up a pole on the plaza.
Thanks. I agree.
No flag should fly above the American flag, it’s disrespectful to the vets.
Why, do they hate Earth?
This whole thing went over your head, clearly.
Right! Respect to the vets.!
Respect the vets!…Until they come back sick or wounded, looking for an education, work, or a stable living situation. Wrap up in the Flag to stay warm.
Why do you want the earth flag above the American flag? Well?
You don’t put an earth memorial on a veterans memorial. It would be like making a memorial in somebody’s honor and then putting somebody else’s flag on top of it. If you want an earth memorial then make one, this is a veterans memorial. If you hate the flag but like the earth flag go get the funds and permission to make an earth memorial.
You are conflating liking the Earth flag with hating the American flag. That’s only happening in your head.
Too much of the time that is exactly what it is. But at the least it is an arrogant insistence on virtue signaling that is a petty misuse of law.
most classic tale of change vs stagnation.
Earth flag on top is progressive position.
US flag on top is a conservative position.
Generally I’ve noticed age makes people critical of change, while youth allows for more flexibility…
I promise to not grow old and stagnant.
No wising up for you!
I think some people are tired of virtue signaling nonsense. When does it stop?
Exactly. This whole thing was a community virtue signal that let just over half the voters feel warm and fuzzy while a woman froze to death just outside city hall.
Well put.
Mm ..
Are you saying all these people claiming their Flag worship equals respect for Veterans is virtue signaling?
It is could be. But then you are the one signaling that your particular flag worship is literally superior to theirs.
Hello Everyone, I chaired the committee to draft that letter. Its true that we contradicted ourselves when we said we supported democracy, but then asked the city to make an exception to measure M. This was an error. Let me explain. I fully intended to gather signatures to propose a new measure. But after speaking with others, I realized another measure probably won’t be necessary because California is about to tell Arcata that Measure M goes against state law anyways. So the purpose of the letter was just to let everyone know it’s a Veteran’s Memorial. Unfortunately, we thought it should have some type of request, so we slapped one on the end: “Please fly the US flag at the top again.”. When Mad River Union pointed this out to me, I slapped my forehead because I missed something so obvious. It’s unfortunate that this became the headline. A more accurate headline would read “The Veterans ACCIDENTALLY ask the city council to go against Measure M”. I regret the error. I think we could have simply announced that the flagpole at the Arcata Plaza is a Veteran’s Memorial.
Right. Agreed.
Sounds like an opportunity for a lawsuit. I’d enjoy hearing of Arcata being forced by court order to put $10-100 million into veterans services and put the American flag on top. Good lesson for the clueless ungrateful.
A lawsuit based on what?
Exactly, the vets sue.
I do suspect that had the public known this particular flagpole was erected in honor of veterans, the law would not have passed. But why should this be the case? How is putting the planet before the nation disrespectful in any way?
Nations cannot exist without the planet for them to exist upon.
Then let the World Government pay the redpect and benefits.
?????
George Carlin on national pride,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iOmQP9guIl0
The title had me thinking it was Arcata veterinarians speaking out, which I thought was nice of them.
I, however, didn’t know the flag pole came from the veterans. This makes it even more egregious that the earth flag is flown above the American flag. At least I was smart enough to vote against this even without this information. People in Arcata can be so silly.
It’s remarkable how worked up people get over their preferred cloth.
And the foolish ideas represented by them. Hello! It’s the ideas that are at issue. Unless of course you have sort of a cloth fetish.
Just like Arcata to do a dumb stunt like this. Go to the US code for displaying the National Flag. US code ss7(f). Our US Flag is flown on TOP of anything else. That is Federal law. No ifs, ands, or buts. All that have served know this.
Arcata is anti america so they put forth absurd measures and vote them in federal law be damned. But if there is grant money available they are on it like starving dogs.
But, no.
I’ve already posted applicable case law in reply to another comment.
How many veterans in general support the Earth flag? And then we are going to choose between veterans who did med work or suffered injury and saw combat? The Earth is important to all of us. Better use of your time as veterans is supporting those with PTSD who can’t get treatment, veterans and also non veterans.
Any vet who wants to can fly the world flag above his country’s. He’s earned some freedom to have respect for his ideas. But what he can’t do is force government to display an agenda that is not part of the government.
I(c)No other flag or pennant should be placed above or, if on the same level, to the right of the flag of the United States of America, except during church services conducted by naval chaplains at sea, when the church pennant may be flown above the flag during church services for the personnel of the Navy.
What happened to “Separation of Church and State?”
Do agnostics or atheists have their own flag?
Yep
Well the Navy has always labored under the most deep valuing of traditions. IDK why except for coming from the British idea of the absolute authority of a ship’s captain. But there it is. It started as every flag did on ship that had no other technology to communicate. Just a way to ring the bell to come to a religious service. Prying tradition out of the hands of the Navy is very difficult. Like many things, every other service will have to change before they do.
“Not only by this conference, but disapproval was also expressed by some Congressmen. In years following, the Secretary of the Navy was even called before Congress to answer whether any pennant flew above “the Stars and Stripes” on Naval vessels.
As the United States entered World War II however, with the extreme support given to the military services and their members during times of war, the practice was codified into U.S. law to permit this Navy tradition to continue, as it does to this day. According to Jonathon Maloney, a Navy Chaplain at sea as of the time this writing, the church pennant is flown above the national colors “every Sunday when I am holding services on Ship.”
So by federal law, this one exception exists that places the identification of the presence of the chaplain and the performance of worship above the emblem of the United States of America.”
https://thechaplainkit.com/history/navy-chaplaincy/navy-chaplaincy/when-the-flag-must-yield/ loop
The vets are right the Planet Flag does not represent any national government entity. I think the voters in Arcata decided the hierarchy should be: City, then County, then State, then Countr, then Earth Third Planet From the Sun. The Planet Flag represents all of humanity, and all creatures (great and small) and this whole beatutiful planet we must share.That is surely something also worth fighting for. I do look forward to a vets letter asking Trump to stop humping the flag; that’s an act I really find offensive.
No flag should ever be on top of the American flag. People need to sit down and remember what that flag represents to our vets both living and passed. To me it is a slap in the face. The Earth flag is fine but fly it at the bottom please.