[UPDATE 4 p.m. from the Ferndale Police Department] Anti-LGBTQ+ Signs Stolen and Defaced at Ferndale Church
Screengrab of a reel by St. Mark’s Lutheran Church in Ferndale which shows the signs that were stolen.
This string of theft and defacement of anti-LGBTQ signs at St. Mark’s Lutheran Church coincides with another incident of theft this month related to LGBTQ issues.
According to Pastor Tyrel Bramwell, the latest incident at the controversial Ferndale Church occurred at 1:41 p.m. on June 13, 2024, following three previous incidents on June 10, June 7, and June 3. “We have video footage of all four hate crimes, and they have all been reported to the Ferndale PD whose officers have responded appropriately according to the law,” Bramwell stated.
A reel posted to Facebook by the Ferndale Church that shows one of the videos.
In addition to stealing the signs, the perpetrators returned some of them with offensive drawings. Parishioner James Graham expressed his frustration, saying, “I can’t believe they brought some of our signs back painted with penises and other things on them. Totally unacceptable.”
The signs that were returned defaced. [Photo from Pastor Bramwell]
Other signs that were defaced. [Photo from Pastor Bramwell]
The Ferndale Police Department is investigating the incidents at St. Mark’s Lutheran Church. We reached out to them but Chief Ron Sligh was unavailable before we posted. Meanwhile, the Eureka Police Department is handling the Pride Flag theft case.
UPDATE 4 p.m.: Sergeant Robert Lindgren of Ferndale Police Department told us that at this point, with the evidence they have, they weren’t planning on charging these incidents as hate crimes. The perpetrators would be charged with “Theft and vandalism at this time in the investigation,” he explained. But, he added, “We do not currently have any suspects. If anyone has any information to help identify the suspects they are encouraged to call the department.”
One suspect. [Image from the Church Facebook page]
Another suspect. [Image from the Church Facebook page]
- Several Anti LGBTQ Acts in Humboldt County Have Sparked Two Colorful Responses–One Yesterday in Arcata and One Today in Ferndale
- Vandalism of Ferndale Church Sign Follows on Heels of Gay Pride March
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The compassionate, caring woke left? Are not others allowed to express their own ideas, free thought is no longer allowed.
Well they did return some of them.
Your MeToo moment has finally come! lol
Go ahead.. but don’t be surprised if you get blowback for pushing an outmoded idea into the public space. There’s a difference between a generally supportive public message, and a unfairly critical public message. I am secure enough in my sexuality that a token symbolic gesture towards 10% of the population doesn’t offend or threaten me. Having to read a mean spirited curse towards 10% of the population still offends my sense of fairness.
So much for freedom of religion, eh?
Freedom of religion doesn’t mean it can avoid criticism, or do nothing wrong. If your religion drives you to a fringe stance that many find insulting, well, there’s no constitutional protections guaranteeing the POPULARITY of your religion.
There are however laws in place protecting your property, which in this case is the basis of any fines or jail time these sad folks will incur.
Last i checked religion was for ones self, nor for others. Though, Jesus was totes about shaming others, and having a closed heart. But even he, the Jeebs is too woke it seems nowadays. There most definitely should be some condemning. Let us think on who Martin Luther founder of the Lutheran would condemn. I’ve read a lot saying that Martin Luther condemns pedophilia and not homosexuality. Mayhaps a better sign on their lawn would be something speaking out about child sex traffikking, or the wholesale institutional molestation? Does the lack of such signage mean that they support pedophilia. I think it may.
Defending hate is not very christian
You don’t have to agree with it, but it’s not hate if it’s genuinely their religious belief — which it is.
What if their religious beliefs included cannibalism?
There’s a difference between religious beliefs and criminal actions.
The compassionate caring left doesn’t support hate.
They seem to hate Israel
You can hate the tactical decisions of militaries that result in the death of thousands of non-combatant civilians without hating the entire country that happens to house that military.
When has stealing personal property and vandalizing said property ever been a free speech violation?
what property. If any property were damaged it’d be a hate crime.
LOL…The only hate crime was putting those signs out originally.
Bramwell is not a Christian. He is an angry bigot using the pulpit to spread his hate.
So a different opinion is hate? That is leading towards the roads of fascism. Aren’t we a nation that is built on ideas and thoughts? Must they all be the same, a vacum chamber if you will. All opinions are valuable and must be tolerated evenly.
When that opinion leads to others being discriminated against or getting physically attacked yes it is hateful.
And that has happened and continues to happen to the LBGT community.
That isn’t the way free speech and free thought works though.
Acts of discrimination and acts of violence may be criminalized, but simply expressing distaste for a groups life choices can’t. Even if that life choice has been the historical target of violence or discrimination.
Distaste?
Are you unfamiliar with the word?
that opinion dose not lead to anything……(Its what most people think)…………
True enough. LBGT people are still attacked by people who think that society has given them permission to do so. Of course religious people are still being attacked by people who think that society has given them permission to do so too.
If you don’t think that battles involving many deaths haven’t happened over the most stupid of excuses, look up the Pastry War. It’s excusing self centered, proxy anger, disingenuous impulses that allows both sides in violent confrontation to equally wrong. And gains both wrong sides their own claques in comments, encouraging further violence.
There you go again with your examples of false equivalency.
Religious people are simply not under attack at anything remotely resembling the same degree as LGBT folks.
Can you give an example of such an attack?
Mathew Shepherd
Mathew Shepherd first came to mind for me also but I didn’t post because anyone (like pcwindham) who needs examples of attacks against LGBT people most likely wouldn’t know or accept the truth if it hit them in the face.
Tragically, examples are not hard to find.
Other notorious homicides against LGBT people include Gwen Araujo, Brandon Teena and Pulse Orlando nightclub.
A more recent example is the murder of Laura Ann Carleton (an LGBT ally and married mother of nine) who was shot dead by a man who first made disparaging remarks about a Pride flag she had flying outside her clothing store.
Thanks. This illustrates one of the problems facing our society. I don’t use social media and get the news primarily from the Wall Street Journal, Reuters, and the BBC. I knew about the Islamist terror attack on the nightclub. Shepherd was apparently killed, not because of his sexual orientation, but as the result of a drug deal gone wrong. The rest of the people you mentioned I had never heard of.
I’m old enough to remember when everyone watched the same TV shows and read the same newspapers. Now we live in isolated silos.
The killers of Mathew Shepherd set him up to rob him (no drug deal that night AFAIK) but that doesn’t explain beating him to a bloody pulp and leaving him to die – if that isn’t evidence of a hate crime I don’t know what is.
One of the killers even attempted a “gay panic” defense.
Hilary Swank won an Oscar for her portrayal of Brandon Teena in “Boys Don’t Cry” so not sure how you missed that.
And of course there are hate crimes targeting Christians but nowhere near the same number or severity as those targeting LGBT people.
Good point on what I see as the demise of credible news sources.
Local newspapers are facing extinction and even major players have trimmed their news bureaus and are forced to compete with tons of unfiltered garbage.
Christians are factually the most persecuted demographic in the world. Violence against the lgb community is less than the average across all demographics in the United States, the murder rate for the lgb community is less than half the average for all demographics in the United States. Lgb people are not persecuted according to those facts.
🫨@tru matters- What are you insinuating? That CHRIST FOLLOWERS have never been attacked or discriminated against???
The alphabet community is not the only group that has ever suffered or been persecuted for their beliefs.
Not insinuating that at all.
St. Mark’s or Christianity wasn’t attacked. Bramwell’s bigoted signs against the LBGTQ community were.
“That CHRIST FOLLOWERS have never been attacked or discriminated against???”
In the United States? No, never, not once, unless you count “Christ Followers” attacking their fellow Christians, which has been a staple of American Christianity since Christians arrived in America. It is literally the reason there were different colonies to begin with, because Christians could not tolerate the beliefs of other Christians.
But sure, collectively Christians are always the victims in America, even though they possess an overwhelming political and social majority in every part of American society and use this power to oppress and persecute non-Christians or those that do not choose to live their private or political lives according to Christian religious beliefs.
Ummm… church shootings? Christian school shootings? I’ll even go a step further and hit you with a double whammy; black church shootings? Taking God out of the pledge of allegiance? Banning bibles in schools? I already have the feeling you’re going to blame the gun
Didja know that “under God..” was added to the Pledge of Allegiance by Eisenhower in the ’50s?
I was surprised to find out it wasn’t Moses when he parted the Intercoastal Waterway after the Israelites departed New Jersey for Florida.
The first coin to have “In God we trust” wasn’t added until 1864 (it was kind of political as it was a Union slogan). The 1950s God stuff was big on stressing “God” in response to the officialy atheist USSR and the Cold War. That was when “IN GOD WE TRUST” being required on all US currency became a law. Oh, and our national motto as well with that law,
Absurd! Are pro-environmental opinions hate because the uni-bomber committed acts of terror based on pro-environmental opinions?
The acts of one person are frequently spun into the “agenda” of many.
His opinion IS hate filled. You not only know this, but apparently share it. If you call yourself a christian, you are lying to yourself
It’s his property. He can do what he wants. I’m sure there’s a law that she can get in trouble for vandalizing or something, and hopefully the law prevails which it never seems to really do. as far as I’m concerned, you could put any freaking sign out in front of your property you want this is a neighborhood issue that the neighbor should deal with if they don’t like it. those signs are not hate. It’s opinion you people don’t even know what real hate is until it hit you in the face. which the majority of you probably never been punched in the face. What happened to our society your grandparents would be so disappointed, especially the ones who fought for our rights
Technically speaking, it’s not his, it’s the church’s and as such signs should only be posted at a church with the support of the congregation.
I’m sorry you were right. I thought that was his house my mistake. I don’t know the rules concerning a church property🤷♂️
I had a good friend back east who used to beat up gay men until he finally at age 45 came out of the closet and moved to San Francisco. Bramwell is obviously hiding something. Look up what causes homophobia.
I looked it up, it’s called Leviticus.
Leviticus is in the torah portion of your bible. That’s for the pre-christians, aka before Jesus. Jesus was a liberal. He hung out with the sinners, homeless and the prostitutes.
you can have whatever opinion you choose, but words have meaning. Leviticus is in opposition to Christianity. Jesus gives you the Christian word. That’s your New testament–
It’s interesting that the other prohibitions of the Old Testament no longer apply:
eating pork and shellfish, working on the Sabbath,
wearing garments of mixed fibers, etc.
But being gay… that’s still a sin.
I’m starting to think that some people are merely using the Bible to justify their homophobia.
It’s ridiculous to think it’s “homophobia”. I don’t know anyone who is afraid of homosexuals.
I’m seasonally gay for polyester/Marino blend long johns.
Jesus came to fulfill the Law of Moses, not to overturn it.
Prove it.
Matthew 5:17-20
It’s nice that most modern western christian people, having been influenced by the enlightenment era, perform insane mental gymnastics in order to square modern morality with the teaching of Jesus and the prohibitions against homosexuality in the bible.
But it could not be more clear that homosexuality is is sin according to the religion. Jesus is said to have kept all the laws in the old testament during his own life. The only exception would be healing miracles on the sabbath.
You are not “more christian” than another because you reject Leviticus. Arguably that would make you less christian, without any doubt it is less christ-like. Even though I find it preferable personally.
Speaking against something that you consider immoral is not tantamount to hate.
Isn’t Leviticus Jewish law?
Are you Christian or Jewish? Christ said to love everyone, no exceptions. I was taught in the early attempts to brainwash me that the followers of Christ were no longer bound by Jewish law.
Again. Christians pick and choose what they want to believe and truth be told, none of it makes much sense.
Pastor Bramwell’s hateful actions remind us of the ugliness that exists,
and should help to motivate people to embrace love and acceptance.
(I think there was some Jewish guy quite some time ago who said something to that effect.)
If Pastor Bramwell has inspired you to to lead with love, The Satanic Temple will send him a thank you card to thank him for providing the inspiration to stand up against his hateful message. https://thesatanictemple.com/products/inspired-donation-thank-you-cards?variant=40112311468166
“Love and acceptance” Would that not include believes you do not agree with, or is rhetoric only used when it favors YOUR opinion?
As long as no one is preaching violence, then yes- even if I don’t agree with them.
Ban windmills……
You’re entitled to your beliefs- even if they’re not supported by facts.
That Jewish guy said to love and accept people WHILE encouraging them not to continue sinning. Just as he famously told the prostitute that was to be stoned, go forth AND SIN NO MORE”.
What hateful action is there evidence of on the part of this pastor?
There is nothing immoral about being gay.
Any group that believes it is, is due for some introspection.
This is the real issue. It comes down to whether you believe there is an objective foundation for morality.
And every different religion firmly believes that only they have an objective foundation for morality. Which makes them all subjective, not objective.
So you believe in solipsism. I don’t
Tim was merely pointing out that nearly every religion purports to have a lock on revealed truth – he was making an observation, not an endorsement. But this wouldn’t be the first time you misread someone’s comment.
Hateful may be in the eye of the beholder, but the pastor is certainly fascinated by the concept.
Ok just to point out what may be taken for granted here. What is a sin in this case? Fornicating with willing, paying customers, or those very customers concocting some “law” that punishes by gruesome death the woman they themselves lusted over? Perhaps bad translation mistated young J-Naz’s point.
First of all, at least these signs were on private property, not a County Courthouse. Second, I thought all these people want is peace, so why trespass on private property and commit crimes? Oh yeah, the whole piece thing is BS. THEY SIMPLY WANT NOTARIETY.
Peace? “These people” want strangers to stop putting signs up calling “us” out for how “we” walk down the st, how “we” buy our groceries, what “we” eat for dinner, where “we” like to go for hikes. Peace is two sided until then it is one side stepping on the other and the other being forced into “wanting peace”. If it doesn’t make you snarl to see that someone would go this far out of their way to say things that are clearly and undeniably hurtful and damaging to ONLY a specific “people”, then you have a crap filled brain.
Whatever happened to “I disagree with what you say but I will defend to the death your right to say it” ?
That went from being a very liberal sentiment to now being something that is rejected by the most vocal on the left.
truth
Huh? That used to be a favorite quote of a conservative highway patrol guy I used to know. He made me listen to Paul Harvey whenever he gave me a ride to school. Conservative politically but he would defend your right to your crazy liberal ideas….
Where does prejiduce factor into that idealic sentiment? This country has a history of deciding who that sentiment applies to.
I disagree. In America everyone decides for themselves.
Better go to your safe place or grow the fuck up
In this country, we have the freedom to believe whatever we want, in God, in Santa Clause, in the Tooth Ferry, in Bigfoot. We also have freedom not to believe. We have the freedom to believe in two genders, created by God or to believe in an unlimited number of made up ones. The fact that someone believes in the two genders and that all other options are a perversion of God’s plan, as this pastor and, actually, all true, Bible believing Christians believe, isn’t in any way hate speech. It is factually true based on scripture. If, however, this is not your belief, that is also your freedom. For those who believe scripture, promoting what scripture teaches is perfectly acceptable, especially on their own property. It does nothing for anyone’s cause to trespass and commit crimes because they disagree. The best approach is, if you disagree or believe differently to just stay away. If I have a bad experience in a business, I can, and often do stop patronizing that business. If I, even as a Bible believing Christian have a bad experience at a Church, I leave and don’t return. Life is far too short to do otherwise.
You mean “they” like a gender neutral pronoun? It looks like one person in the picture.
““According to California Law, a hate crime must involve the use of force, threats, or the damaging, destroying, or defacing of property. ”
Well, well, well. As the democrats say, “no one is above the law”
Under California law, destroying someone else’s property, could be considered a criminal offense, such as vandalism or theft. Whether it constitutes a hate crime would depend on the specific circumstances and motivation behind the act, as well as how the law is interpreted and applied.
Looks like they were defaced to me. Wow, just wow , i pasted that directly from the article, and it came directly from the sheriff department. Looks like you’re trying to spin the law. At least the woman didn’t mark legal expenses that were legal expenses on her taxes, right?
The snippet you posted referred to theft of the flag at the courthouse which was determined not to be a hate crime based on the info currently available. It did not refer to the signs at the church in Ferndale. And it was posted by the Eureka PD, not the Sheriff’s Office. Was there anything you didn’t get wrong?
The flag theft is only not deemed a hate crime because the evidence is hidden, gone. No matter if one’s opinion is the flag should or shouldn’t have been put up in a public space it was stolen and no doubt trashed but like a murder if the body isnt found takes a whole lot of circumstantial evidence to prove it. One could argue that removing the flag was defacing or vandalism i suppose and still “hate” gets tricky to define, prove and procecute.
Stealing the flag was theft.
There is no evidence it was defaced, vandalized or trashed.
I agree proving a hate crime can be difficult.
Recovery of the flag might or might not provide useful evidence but that would only be one of many factors to consider.
You mean paying the pornstar to keep quiet about bumping uglies while your wife has a new baby?…with campaign money while running for President?
Hey I heard the Stable Genius Golf Champ is soliciting donations to help pursue his FAMILY VALUES agenda.
Tell us again about how Ashley Biden’s dairy is legit. Looks like we have a true nasty in the Oval …
Dairy operations are generally an accepted practice. However pressure has been applied over the last couple decades to apply best practices to reduce any animal suffering. Thankfully there are more options available now for the lactose intolerant.
No, I mean using campaign funds to fund a fake dossier, and interfere in an, election. Family values? You mean like inappropriately showering with an 11 year old daughter? Having an affair with a married woman (Jill), as alleged by her ex husband. Don’t cast stones if you live in a glass house
Jill’s ex husband?
Is now a good time to bring up Donald Trump’s Spiritual Advisor while in office, Pastor ROBERT MORRIS, Gateway Church?
It’s almost like getting paid to wave a Bible around doesn’t automatically make you a good person.
Exactly!
And because religious bigots are not a “protected class” the theft and vandalism would not be hate crimes even if motivated by hate, but the theft and vandalism would still be crimes and could be prosecuted as such.
Are you saying that lgbtq+ are a “protected class”, and that religion is not a “protected class”? Time to dust off your constitution..
It depends on what the law actually says and how it’s interpreted by the courts – not by your opinion or mine.
Tru matters explanation (scroll up) was complete and accurate. My comment, which was a slam at religious bigots, not so much.
You are correct that religion is a protected class but the term (and it’s application) is defined in legislation, not the Constitution.
If you want to see real bigotry and hatred, try telling a non religious person you’re a Christian
I’m not religious and I have absolutely no hate or animosity for anyone of any religion.
This feigned persecution thing is rather silly.
I will, however, call out anyone who promotes hatred.
Jebs quit lying. We all know you for what you are.
I’ve read many of your comments, and more often than not your “calling out hate” is more about mischaracterizing a differing point of view as “hate” to gain advantage in an argument.
Don’t you berate and belittle the religious and their religions, at least Christian ones, in comments quite frequently? Even those who pray for peace and good will by being offended by their attempting to inflict their religion on you by doing so? If there is never any good to be found in a group, that pretty much defined hating. As does never finding bad in a group either.
I do mock the ridiculousness and hypocrisy of some religious beliefs.
But I am fully supportive of someone’s right to believe those things
so long as they do not harm others.
Feigned persecution. Good choice of wording and can be used for what the LGB community is claiming as hate. A pastor is preaching for people to love the body God gave them and to not mutilate themselves … that is NOT hate. He has a great relationship with Foggy Bottom Boy, Stratton.
The LGB community is not threatened – to say so is absolutely false.
You want to know who is being persecuted – girls losing to boys in sports and ergo losing SCHOLARSHIPS which are rightfully theirs because some subpar boy decided to “play” as a girl.
That is persecution. #changemymind
Let’s call this trans epoch what it is: WOMANFACE. And it is just as disgusting as blackface.
Your last paragraph counters the point you originally set out to make.
You have a warped sense of reality.
Please explain.
“I will call out anyone who promotes hatred.”
Defacing signs is pretty hateful of another’s opinion. Are you going to denounce these incidents, or only the ones on the flip?
I don’t agree with this, I also don’t agree with the flag incident in Eureka.
Bramwell is doing his job, he feels compelled to save others from some nameless skydaddy. I don’t necessarily subscribe to his ideas per se, but I also don’t believe that gives a pass to the alternate viewpoint to have carte blanche to do as they please. I subscribe to astrology, if he puts up a sign against astrologists, I’ll take the Thomas Stratton route and still give him a hug at Renner.
Each side has freedom of speech – when someone trespasses to deface property, that’s illegal. Technically, freedom of speech doesn’t leave room for “hate” speech. If someone says something truly ghastly, well then now you know who they are and can avoid them in the future. Just saying something someone else doesn’t like, is not in and of itself inciteful. If someone cannot control themself and does harm based on an others speech – that’s on them … we all have free will. The job of the Constitution is not to provide safety. Nope, not at all. You have the right to defend yourself though …
Now, back to my last sentence: are you trying to say woman are feigning persecution due to the outright misogyny that is this new epoch? “K!LL ALL T3RFS” – yes, that’s a quote and it’s *proudly* sold online on teeshirts (sometimes with the image of an ak next to it!), is HATE and VIOLENT … so tell me, am I feigning anything? Nope.
Not once did I defend the vandalism.
I believe it was wrong.
And not once did I dismiss misogyny as a serious problem.
It is.
So is misandry
only for misogynists…
Agreed
I abhor religion, not the religious.
With few exceptions I dont find their rejection of homosexuality as a “sin” to be a form of hatred.I think most of them love sinners and wan to keep them from being condemned to hell.
I think misconstruing this as hatred is very dangerous.
Yes, Bramwell himself will tell you he loves lesbians. I’m not joking.
Thing is, no one apparently wants to actually have a nuanced discussion with him.
Yes, Kaelan and Lark, I’m talking to you two specifically since I believe you have it in you and you’re the loudest in media, and Sister Gaia. Sister Juana seems to have an even stance, too. Redwood Pride et al will stand there and shout in Bramwell’s front yard, but they won’t actually DO THE WORK to come to some sort of consensus. So much so, people are actively defacing church property.
He doesn’t hate you. He hates the idea of anyone going to h3ll. That’s his opinion, and you don’t have to agree with it, but you certainly don’t get to be atrocious to someone with a differing opinion.
Last year a now defunct media site in HumCo offered to host a summit. Bramwell said he’s game. What about you, Queer Humboldt et al – want to actually take a stance and have a REAL conversation? Maybe the two sides can sell tickets and give the proceeds to a mutually agreed upon charity – if they can agree on one of those to start, there’s BOUND to be more they can agree on going forward: like both denouncing defacement of public and private property on both sides.
@ Kym, you want to host? Maybe even have it at the Old Steeple.
Don’t forget, signage works!
No. I can’t even do the job I have.
Great answer!
Ok, saying “I love you, but you are going to suffer an imaginary eternal damnation”
is a backhanded, passive aggressive curse. It’s avoiding the responsibility of their own prejudice.
If you want to see real bigotry and hatred, try telling a 4th of July “Christian” that you’re actually a Sikh, and not Muslim.
Give me a break. You have never once experienced any bigotry or hatred from an atheist and you know it.
I’ve seen it here.
Wtf is a protected class? Link please
Now you are just making shit up
TBT making shit up?
Oh, ye of little faith!
You might want to expand your sources of information but here’s a starting point for you:
PROTECTED CLASSES
•Race
•Color
•Religion (includes religious dress and grooming practices)
•Sex/gender (includes pregnancy, childbirth, breastfeeding and/ or related medical conditions)
•Gender identity, gender expression
•Sexual orientation
•Marital status
•Medical Condition (genetic characteristics, cancer or a record or history of cancer)
•Military or veteran status
•National origin (includes language use and possession of a driver’s license issued to persons unable to provide their presence in the United State is authorized under federal law)
•Ancestry
•Disability (mental and physical including HIV/AIDS, cancer, and genetic characteristics)
•Genetic information
•Request for family care leave
•Request for leave for an employee’s own serious health condition
•Request for Pregnancy Disability Leave
•Retaliation for reporting patient abuse in tax-supported institutions
•Age (over 40)
* Source: The California Department of Fair Employment and Housing
Rise above the narrowness of choosing a political side, it can only trap you in hypocrisy and tribal bias.
Every political philosophy can be applicable depending on the scenario, from communism to libertarianism. Understanding the world requires flexibility, Identifying with a certain political affiliation will only allow a rigid perspective, and often leads to rationalizing others opinions as “hateful” because it does not fit into that rigid tribal affiliation.
Preach!
A nuanced response … so lacking in today’s discourse.
Good point
The unintended consequence of stealing or vandalizing the signs is that the vandals have amplified the message of the religious bigots.
Except for people driving by the church in Ferndale the rest of us would probably never have heard about it.
Then there’s that thing about free speech…but apparently the vandals believe it’s for me, not thee.
On this , I agree with you 🤗
👍
This is a major contradiction that very few want to contend with. If stopping the spread of hate is the goal, amplifying hateful content from a few dozen to a few thousand is counter productive.
In addition, the vandals undercut their message (whatever it might be) by putting the focus on their own bad behavior.
And they’d be the first to be outraged if anyone went on their property and tore down or defaced their signs.
They surely would
EXACTLY!!!!!!
I called a booby trap and he got her trespassing on his property. She should be punished, but all in all he has the right to do what he did.
The pushback begins
Nothing beats a good game of Capture The Flag.
What about a bestiality flag? Lots of folks out there prefer their furry friends.Why do these LGBQT people get to shake their perversions in everyones faces? Most of us dont care what someone else does in private between consenting adults. What we dont like is when its stuck our faces.
Ummmm, it wasn’t LGBQT people who put out the signs, and the pride flag is about just that. And what perversions are you referring to?
For a Christian, pride is the mother of all sins.
And it goeth before the fall …
America is falling, a quickly at that.
So a craftsman should not take pride in his work. We shouldn’t be proud of our children?
It is a matter of balance like everything else. I suppose we are all teeter-tottering here, LOL. Definitions get complicated. I don’t much understand pride..why not just love children and enjoy one’s work? What’s the significant difference? I’m not religious and pride and arrogance do seem to be very very closely related, a slippery slope our culture in general focuses too much on.
Did Moses leave any insight about playing selective word games with 4,000 year old translations?
Speaking of pride, how would you assess presidential candidate Trump’s golf skills? Electric boat sinking-quick thinking shark fighter? Maybe it’s a sin for someone so excellent NOT to pump the braggadocio.
Its a dirty habit!
Nobody is sticking anything in anyone’s faces.
That would be illegal.
Oh, there’s somebody out there that does!
Good lord… don’t come near my dogs, Ed.
No dogs; goats look out!
Wait a second so your comparing raping a helpless animal, bestiality, to what is done in your own words, between consenting adults? Also heterosexuals do not keep their affections restricted to “in private” so why should others? No matter my feelings about subjects one way or another your contradictions are inapplicable to the article’s topic.
Never steal or deface hateful signs like those posted at the church– it lets you know who to avoid like the plague. Simply put up alternative signs nearby if you feel you must.
This is from June 2021. Bramwell has been spreading his bigotry for years.
“Our Savior’s Lutheran Church on Shaw Avenue, just a few blocks away from St. Mark’s, adorned its own sign with an apparent response to their neighboring house of worship. “We welcome everyone!” it reads. “Jesus said all are precious in his sight. Love is always the answer.”
The sign at St Mark’s said:
Hurt By LGBTQ Culture
Healing Here
Would those folks qualify as butthurt?
Marxists have no respect for private property because they think the state should own or control everything.
No.
But we do think churches should pay taxes.
Why should they pay taxes?
Because many organizations cloak themselves in religion to run confidence scams on their parishioners. Some “Church” run businesses are moneymakers funneling cash to their principals. Adventist Health?
Have you any proof to support your accusation against Adventist Health? You’re mixing apples and oranges. There’s a huge difference between an insurance company and community churches. Adventist HealthCare is a faith-based organization that provides care to the community at large as well as to high-risk populations such as the uninsured and underserved. Adventist Health System rebranded to Advent Health in 2019.
Reading assignment:
https://www.amazon.com/Exposing-Mega-Churches-Prosperity-Gospel/dp/1798519798
Thank you. People involved in those activities only fooling themselves.
Because they use that which taxes pay for.
Churches get to pick and choose privately who and how they provide charity and support to; government has general rules etc. that the general public has a hand in creating and affecting.
Churches do a good job of helping people that needs assistance.
As should all non profits
Wow! Has the main stream media picked up on this startling rise of Marxism in Ferndale!? Why, fast forward 100 years, Communist Ferndale is going to be an industrial manufacturing powerhouse, dominating the global trade in cheap goods. Skyrocketing growth won’t be sustainable for long, soon the economic elites will search out foreign investment opportunities to preserve their wealth for generations. Communism is no joke kids. Especially gay communism.
Typical Biden voting Karen showing her “dumb as a rock” credentials = not realizing video cameras are everywhere, especially at a church begging for somebody to do just this, dumbazzzzz. People who do this need to be run through the justice system simply because they are so dumb they deserve it, and have shown they cannot control their emotions. Imagine if dumb Karen had been behind the wheel of a car and spotted a person holding a sign on the sidewalk. Could she be trusted to not flip out and mow the person down? The answer is No, Karen cannot be trusted.
And to the church, grow up. Should have put a giant yellow Happy Face out front and called it good. Just ignore the pushy Pride people, you owe them nothing whatsoever.
Ignoring the “candy aisle” kids is the best thing you can do when they’re throwing a fit.
No attention for you! Three years!
Well done!
This man has been tormenting the LGBTQ community since he has been there.
The only hate is what’s coming from the so-called pastor and his demented followers. Nobody is peeping into their bedrooms, maybe they should keep their noses out of everybody else’s.
Miss Kym, the headline could use a little adjusting, it say “fortuna pd”. Hope all is well.
The left has been on a race to the ethical and moral bottom for decades and 90% of America is disgusted with it. Here are just a few scriptures to examine. If you disagree, don’t argue with me on RHBB. Your argument is with God.
Leviticus 18:22 You shall not lie with a male as with a woman; it is an abomination.
1 Corinthians 6:9-11 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.
Jude 1:7Just as Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding cities, which likewise indulged in sexual immorality and pursued unnatural desire, serve as an example by undergoing a punishment of eternal fire.
1 Corinthians 6:9-10 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.Romans 1:26-28 For this reason God gave them up to dishonorable passions. For their women exchanged natural relations for those that are contrary to nature; and the men likewise gave up natural relations with women and were consumed with passion for one another, men committing shameless acts with men and receiving in themselves the due penalty for their error. And since they did not see fit to acknowledge God, God gave them up to a debased mind to do what ought not to be done.Deuteronomy 22:5 A woman shall not wear a man’s garment, nor shall a man put on a woman’s cloak, for whoever does these things is an abomination to the Lord your God.1 Corinthians 6:18 Flee from sexual immorality. Every other sin a person commits is outside the body, but the sexually immoral person sins against his own body.Romans 1:24-25 God gave them up in the lusts of their hearts to impurity, to the dishonoring of their bodies among themselves, because they exchanged the truth about God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever! Amen.
Personally, I doubt that Bible verses are an effective tool for convincing the unbeliever. And copy-pasting multiple Bible verses and links can be overwhelming and triggers my comment software so that you have to be moderated. Please consider using a more effective strategy for future attempts to convert those of us who are not quite as fervent as you are that the Bible is the unsullied word of God.
I think that the Bible is intended as more of a set of, “all to often lost in translation
guidelines”, for the believer, or for someone that may be “straddling the fence”, so to speak, belief-wise, and much less intended to convert nonbelievers into being believers…
It appears to me that Country Joe’s comment is in no way part of, “…attempts to convert those of us who are not quite as fervent as, [Country Joe is], that the Bible is the unsullied word of God.”
Even after rereading it a couple of times to hopefully confirm it…
He has chosen but a few relevant excerpts, to illustrate his point.
I’m not sure why some non-believers are so adamant that ALL believers invariably take EVERYTHING that is written in The Bible literally, as a hard and fast rule, word for word…
That simply isn’t true, Kym.
It’s a very inaccurate stereotype.
“Painting with a broad brush…”
To be fair, I have also reread your comment a couple of times, and you really don’t seem to be quite literally suggesting that…
But, from some of your previous comments, I gather that you have found SOME Biblical passages that you have found outlandish enough to cast doubt and/or disbelief, on ALL that is written in EVERY Bible…
That is unfortunate in my opinion…
Have you not found a single passage in any version of the Bible that you find rings true, or that is worthy advice…???
If any person only looks for the bad or the off putting, in something, that’s all that they will see, and if they discard the whole book for those certain passages, much of value may be overlooked…
If any person only tried to sift out the truth from it all, they might find a few valuable nuggets…
But being a believer or non believer does not even hinge upon a literal belief in the Bible.
They are not necessarily even mutually contingent.
Two totally different concepts.
I try and focus on what rings true…
Basing the existence or non-existence of God, based on the Bible, (a work of man), is simply shaky logic.
Bible verses can be read, considered or ignored. I realize that most liberals are unbelievers. This may be the only place they see verses from the Bible. Can you recommend a more effective strategy because I’m not trying to convert anyone. I’m just providing evidence for my post.
The Bible isn’t evidence.
It is a compilation of stories and beliefs from a long time ago.
One could also quote Confucius, Aesop’s Fables, or Hammurabi’s Code.
It wouldn’t prove anyone right or wrong, it would just show what some people believe.
Actually, to the people for whom it is the word of God, it is exactly that. Evidence. Just because you think differently doesn’t mean you are right to discount everything it says.
Actually Confucius, Aesop’s Fables AND the Bible offer understanding and reason. So does Taoism, Buddhism, Islam, etc. These are observations on humanity by peopke who thought about it and extrapolation of those observations. They deserve respect. Even if you don’t believe in the Bible as a communication from a superior being. Empathy would require that if you believe empathy has value.
Well we disagree. For Christians, the simplest definition of the Bible is “the Word of God to humankind.” Beyond its two main sections (the Old Testament and the New Testament), the Bible contains several more divisions: the Pentateuch, the Historical Books, the Poetry and Wisdom Books, the books of Prophecy, the Gospels, and the Epistles.
If someone were to start quoting the Book of Mormon or the Pearl of Great Price at you as proof that Mormonism is the religion that you should be following, wouldn’t you find that a bit silly? Now if they quoted the Bible, a book you believed and offered evidence from there, that might persuade you. Similarly, if you want to prove that your religion is valuable, first live it in such a way that I can see its value in the way you comment, in the joy, love, and positivity that you bring to the conversation. Second, find books and facts that I agree with that make your point.
When I was dragged into Girl Scouts against my will, I remember a program where the group was taken to services in various churches, temples, etc to expose the children to different religions. I was shocked by a fundamentalist preacher who said “Hell” (Hell was only a swear word I thought at age 8). I was dazzled by the Catholic liturgy (and all the singing.) And thoroughly confused by the Buddhists and Jews. The Shinto shrine beautiful but full of symbolism I couldn’t grasp.
But all had one thing in common. They were a social group and were useful to a lot of people who needed structure. And pretty much the actual structure was not that important. No one should casually attempt to disparage any structure that someone might need. Instead person can argue from within that structure or, if they can’t, walk away.
” Second, find books and facts that I agree with that make your point.” That might be a difficult mission. Sadly, there isn’t much joy, love or positivity on social media where personal attacks are the norm. I respond in kind on social media to the negativity and hate.
How about this?
Today the sun is shining. Our family’s two dogs are trying to sneak onto the couch or each other’s beds and being impossibly cute in the process even though I only got 5 and a half hours sleep last night in part due to them. I don’t agree with much of your politics but our personal email interaction makes me think you are a decent human being who’d likely make a decent neighbor. You are probably not going to convince me about the existence of God when the kindest, most loving human being I ever knew (and many other people have told me they agree), my own mom, could not do that past when I reached the age of reason. But she and I had a lovely relationship and were able to have many lovely conversations about her personal testimony.
Let’s try to have conversations here where we recognize that each other’s beliefs are different, I won’t mock yours. You don’t mock mine. And we try to understand where each other is coming from.
It’s a bit rough to have that conversation when you start with “The left has been on a race to the ethical and moral bottom for decades and 90% of America is disgusted with it. Here are just a few scriptures to examine. If you disagree, don’t argue with me on RHBB. Your argument is with God.” That basically says you are only interested in hearing from me (and other commenters) if I agree, and I don’t. And I can only talk with your God that I don’t believe in. So that doesn’t leave a lot of room for discussion in which case why bother posting in a public forum if you aren’t interested in a free discussion with folks who have differing opinions.
But how about we discus this one aspect of this life we do share:
What makes a comment section so useful and interesting to you that you want to spend time on it? What ways could we both improve the experience for each other?
Well, I woke up this morning with my purring cat sitting on my chest. She knows I just had major spinal cord surgery and is very comforting. I am an excellent neighbor as far as I know and I’m sure you are too.
I was referring to the Bible passages when I said take your argument to God not me.
Let’s improve the experience for all.
I woke up yesterday morning with my purring cat gently patting my eyelids. To be honest I was less than thrilled even though she was pretty cute.
I am sorry you have just had major surgery. The stress and the pain must be extremely difficult to deal with.
That’s a big problem with the religious right. This whole bible driven mindset is quite outdated for many of us in the middle. Similar to how the far left can’t keep quiet about their sexual preferences—it just turns some of us off to the message.
Whether or not America is on a slide to the bottom, (as it were🍑🌈) those verses you quoted are trancribed from Mediterranean tribes’ oral tradition of 4,000 years ago. From what you post, it sounds like homosexuality was fairly popular.
The Bible is always open to interpretation. Help yourself.
🙄🙄
The church and its congregation are the ones perpetrating hate crimes.
Not those removing the hate speech.
Freedom of Speech is a given Right, but hate speech must be reigned in, as it is in France.
It is time to say NO to the haters, like this so called “church” , who engender hatred and division.
They are promoting ignorance and the perpetuation of misogynistic, patriarchal power and their time is up.
Don’t tolerate intolerance.
You should move to France
Not a hate crime, they’re not targeting the church because it’s Christian, they’re targeting it because the pastor is an asshole.
It’s not tolerance if it requires agreement. It’s tolerance when disagreement is not fatal.
Does the artist responsible for that penis hire out for portraits?
Good one.
Not a hate crime?! It’s been a proven fact that if you call someone who is gay/trans/non-binary/ or any other made up gender you toss in there. It’s a fact, call anyone of a different nature anything even remotely offensive and it’s categorized as a hate crime.
The rainbow is actually taken from the Bible.
Genesis 9:12-13 God promises a rainbow as a sign of his covenant with all living creatures on Earth after the flood, reminding them that he will never again allow floodwaters to destroy all life. The rainbow is described as a sign of God’s protection and a symbol of hope, promising better times to come.
Funny that’s what the LGBTQ+ community chose to go with.
As Christians we are to love the sinners, not the sin. We believe it’s wrong based on scripture we believe to be the truth. We do not have to agree with you. These signs are no different than a Christian seeing a trans flag bumber sticker on the back of a car. It’s not like I’m going to jump out and vandalize your bumper sticker. No, I’m going to go about me day and I’ll even smile if you pass me. I won’t stoop to a new level of pettiness and think I’m smarter and have the upper hand doing so.
This just goes to show how sad of a person this poor girl is.
You are incorrect. It is not nice but it is not a crime to call someone a slur. Here’s what the San Diego County Attorney explained:
A hate crime is any offense committed against you or your property because of your race, ethnicity, religion, nationality, disability, gender or sexual orientation. Anybody can be a victim. White, heterosexual males can be victims, as can African-American women. The language of the law is very broad and protects everyone, not one particular group.
To qualify as a hate crime, bias against you need not be the only reason you were attacked, as long as it was a substantial factor in the criminal’s selection of you as a target.
Also, it does not matter if you are a member of the group that your attacker thinks you are, only that your attacker perceives you to be a member of that group. If someone hits you because he thinks you are Hispanic, but you are White or Native American, you are still a victim of a hate crime. If an attacker beats up your friend thinking your friend is gay, but your friend is actually straight, your friend is a victim of a hate crime. Law enforcement can prosecute the criminal for the hate crime without waiting for him to strike again.
What is a hate incident?
A hate incident is an act, which is bias-motivated, but does not rise to the level of a hate crime. So, if someone uses a racial or other slur against another, it is probably not a hate crime, rather it is a hate incident. These occurrences are frequently frightening and upsetting, but they are not criminal.
https://www.sdcda.org/helping/hate-crimes-faq
This thread is like a game of battle between mental midgets – I hate ur shit no I hate ur shit yeah but I hate ur shit more oh yeah well my shit is bigger than ur shit – and while we’re playing the battle of mental midgets someone is emptying our wallets – good thing we’re distracted playing our all encompassing game of battle of the mental midgets.
You are so off base. I’m pretty sure my all powerful sky God does not like your behavior. Do you even have your signs printed yet? If God favored your position, HE would have led you to the print shop.
You are welcome.
Divide and conquer said the non mental midget
The church put the signs out clearly to bait people into taking them and then put the images of them and their freedoms being trampled on by the woke left.The pastor is not trying to do food or follow the teachings of Jesus Christ by loving your neighbor. It’s just a bad faith publicity stunt.shit like this is specifically meant to divide us, there is no hate like Christian “love”. Bless up everyone, I’ll be praying for this so called pastor, Lord forgive him.
Equally so is every Pride flag then. Certainly the Sisters of Perpetual Indugence are especially exactly that. Choosing to retaliate is not sanctified by being provoked by disagreeable signage.
So someone is going to have to explain to me why stealing a pride flag is a hate crime. While stealing a “pride” sign is not…. Oh wait! Is it because the person that stole the flag is a lower class drug addict? And the person that stole the signs is a productive member of society?
Hmmmmmm….. is there a disparity in the way people are charged for crimes depending on their social status? Me thinks yes.
Last I heard the dude that stole the pride flag wasn’t charged with a hate crime.
I’d love to try
Excerpted from an earlier comment of mine:
“There’s a difference between a generally supportive public message, and a unfairly critical public message. I am secure enough in my sexuality that a token symbolic gesture towards 10% of the population doesn’t offend or threaten me. Having to read a mean spirited curse towards 10% of the population still offends my sense of fairness.”
I’m not saying stealing and defacing the signs was wise in the long run, but this is my take on why one person felt like it.
That is pretty much a distinction without a difference in this case. The sign that a marriage is between a man and woman was not left because it was “an uncritical public message.” The rest of the signs were not clear but some probably were specifically critical. idk. But it is unlikely that was a consideration by any party at any point.
Lately the most mild difference rises to the level of needing retaliation. Self justification follows. It’s disingenuous to rationalize that as benign with the Pride Flag and malign in scripture quotes. It’s the use to which it is put that makes anything either.
I’ve often wondered why calling a woman a bitch while raping her is not treated as a hate crime while calling man another slur while hitting him is. There is way too little principle in those legal differences and a whole lot of rationalization.
Based on the evidence currently available, the Eureka and Ferndale PD’s do not consider theft of the flag or the signs to be hate crimes.
Where are you getting the idea that the flag thief was charged with a hate crime?
Who knows. The guy probably stole the flag at the courthouse because he needed toilet paper and chose the flag which was easiest to grab. The Razor concept….The other ones at the church temporarily lost their minds and should not be operating vehicles or have access to tools or metal/hard plastic objects. It’s the rubber room for them until they get psychological intervention. In any case, it’s a conundrum……First World problem….Go Figure…..
Basing your personality and life around your sexual orientation is so boring and uninteresting.
Hope they go to jail. Such hypocrites afraid of opposing views. I wanna go to that church. I love their stance
Substitute “Black” or “Indian/Native American” or any other minority for the church’s message instead of LGBT+. Sound that out in your head. Would you consider a church so public with those messages as just an opposing view?
It’s pride month wtf did they expect? 😂😂😂😂
What if I lived across the street from St, Marks and put up a bunch of signs denouncing Christianity?
Think I might get a visit from Bramwell?
Make no mistake, the Religious Right is coming for American like never before. Humboldt included. Think of Louisiana. Seems far away, doesn’t it. Nyet. It’s home now to a former (very wealthy) Eureka resident, who also donated something like $200K to the political machinery behind its newish Governor and Attorney General.
Louisiana, part of ground zero for the Religious Right, Opus Dei included. The newish Governor and his backers put forth the new “10 Commandments on classroom walls” law. They WANT the law challenged and going to their now Religious Right-stacked Supreme Court, opening the door wide to the Nation. It’s just one more step for them in tearing at the tenuous separation in the USA, of Church and State.
Their con-job candidate — former President Trump — approved their last three pre-selected SCOTUS picks. With slimy Trump, they struck gold. We’ve now a stacked SCOTUS, Religious Right Mike Johnson running the Congress, and the prospect of Trump back in office (the least Christian president, ever) gunning for civil servants, judges, the of Education, even the FBI. It’s the Religious Right’s ‘Deep State’ scam, just one of their many scams cooked up by their operatives. The FBI, who’s deemed domestic terrorism a major threat. As to the latter, the domestic terror threat, look at who they back for President.
The Religious Right and their lawyers, religious law, and gunslingers, coming for America.
https://www.ncronline.org/news/leonard-leo-architect-conservative-supreme-court-takes-wider-culture
*Dept (of Education)
What does the Bible say about false prophets?
its really funny the sign that reads “Born in a boys body, you’re a boy” offends someone
Catch up. The modern age has brought about technologies that have allowed us to study the planets animals, including humans at a level of detail previously impossible. Perhaps this is part of God’s gift. Turns out gender fluidity is fairly common among plants and other animals. Humans may be no different. If you ask the humans how they feel about others romantically, turns out about ten percent feel some other kind of way than your basic Male/Female biology might indicate. Judging from Bible verses on the topic this has been the case for several millennia, if not forever.
That sign may just display basic ignorance, but for somebody born feeling different, it’s an attempt to shame them for something they can’t help.
I grew up in ferndale this town use to never be this way until city ass holes moved in and, divided the town. Go aheadand, get this crap out no one cares that your gay straight or, ect quit be idiots and, just learn to coexist with each other. We dont need stupid signs to express who we are.
Maybe you missed it but the signs were put up by an anti-LGBT pastor of a local church – they were not put up by LGBT people.
Maybe the pastor needs to learn how to coexist with people who have different views?
The same advice for the LGBT crowd.
Isn’t that exactly what they’re trying to do?
I think the pastor should get some neon signs now up the ante
So the video shows that they were both named Karen