Save the Redwoods Puts up Ugly Sign in Salmon Creek

ugly sign obscuring beautiful view

Ugly Sign of the Times

Frequent Photo

On a unspoiled ridge top, a quiet dirt road meanders through a meadow thick with grass.  A spectacular view allows a driver or hiker  to see nearly halfway across California–from the fog on the coast to the golden ridges of the Yolla Bollies.  The only hint of  human habitation is the road and a neighbor’s gate discretely tucked into the hillside-at least until today.  Save the Redwoods recently purchased a piece of property there and the community was delighted.  What better neighbor than an environmental organization.  What a great fit for our nature loving community.

But something has gone terribly wrong.  The League put up an ugly billboard.  For a neighborhood, in which there are no street signs, such a large garish construction makes a mockery of the League’s environmental goals.

Change is inevitable.  Ugliness is not.”  Scenic America, an organization dedicated to preserving open spaces and curtailing the use of billboards, chose this as their motto.  They say,

Attractive communities and unspoiled scenic vistas are critical to our quality of life. Both encourage us to appreciate and maintain beauty and the natural environment.

Each new billboard that is constructed tarnishes our communities and despoils our countryside. Moreover, each new billboard reinforces the perception that ugliness is the price of progress — that our quality of life depends on destroying the very resources we most value. This false choice serves only those who benefit from blight, and it encourages us to accept the destruction of all scenic, environmental, and historic resources…

Save the Redwoods League will agree when they’ve thought about the visual blight they’ve added to a space dedicated to natural beauty. Take a moment and call the League and ask them to reconsider their action. When they realize what they’ve done,  they will surely remove the sign.

E-mail: [email protected]

Save the Redwoods League
114 Sansome Street, Suite 1200
San Francisco, CA 94104-3823

Telephone: (415) 362-2352
Toll Free: (888) 836-0005
Fax: (415) 362-7017

Sadly, we as a society have become so inured to the ugliness of billboards encroaching on our views that one of our most venerable environmental organizations– dedicated to preserving natural beauty– put a large sign up oblivious to the irony and the ugliness! Please help us help them realize what they’ve done.

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153 Comments
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Staff
Member
14 years ago

I just want to add that the sign itself is well built but in the culture of our community no one puts up large signs. Small no trespassing signs are found tacked on trees but for literally miles ( I’m guessing around 15–the freeway exit sign) there is no equivalent sized billboard. We don’t even have much in the way of street signs. We do have two community bulletin boards that are discreetly placed and non-institutional looking. And for miles there are no utility poles–nothing to spoil the untouched look of our beautiful countryside. Let’s keep it that way.

Scott
Guest
Scott
14 years ago

Call the County, those things need permits!

MR Rogers
Guest
MR Rogers
14 years ago

I have a quick way to remove it (chainsaw)
And I could use the wood

MR Rogers
Guest
MR Rogers
14 years ago

I have a quick way to remove it (chainsaw)
And I could use the wood

sohumborn
Guest
sohumborn
14 years ago

I have a hard time picturing conservationists placing that sign & not getting how ironic it was. All Like “Look at this beautiful unspoiled wilderness!” I cant help but laugh, even though I hate it. I wrote and I’ll call as soon as I get to a phone.

sohumborn
Guest
sohumborn
14 years ago

I have a hard time picturing conservationists placing that sign & not getting how ironic it was. All Like “Look at this beautiful unspoiled wilderness!” I cant help but laugh, even though I hate it. I wrote and I’ll call as soon as I get to a phone.

Lynn
Guest
Lynn
14 years ago

Where is this sign Kym? Is it really literally up on the ridge? And I am curious as to why the League bought the property. Are there redwoods on it? Is it useful to the org in its mission (not that I’ve read their mission statement, only working on assumptions here)? Not that they shouldn’t purchase property…but if I was a donor or member of the org, I’d ask these questions before they spent money on it. SO, it makes me curious.

??

Steven
Guest
Steven
14 years ago
Reply to  Lynn

This sign is at the top of my driveway despite the fact that Save The Redwoods League bought 100s of acres stretching for miles! The contact name at STRL is Christine Ambrose 415-362-2352, the sign installer told me she led him up here and showed him where to put the sign.

Staff
Member
14 years ago
Reply to  Steven

You want extension 310 to reach her at that number.

Staff
Member
14 years ago
Reply to  Lynn

Yes, it is really up on the ridge but towards the back side of the loop. I think the property is perfect for them. It helps connect a green belt which is an environmentally sound practice. I believe it has redwoods though I haven’t been on the property. I would love to hike the piece. I’m glad they’re our neighbor. I’m just not happy with the sign.

Steven
Guest
Steven
14 years ago

This sign is at the top of my driveway despite the fact that Save The Redwoods League bought 100s of acres stretching for miles! The contact name at STRL is Christine Ambrose 415-362-2352, the sign installer told me she led him up here and showed him where to put the sign.

Staff
Member
14 years ago
Reply to  Steven

You want extension 310 to reach her at that number.

Ernie's Place
Guest
14 years ago

This is going to be a difficult comment for me to make, but I’ll try.

Save the Redwoods League is one of the better environmental organizations, so I won’t criticize them, but, some are complete charlatans. As soon as you start to realize that the environment isn’t the focus of their zeal, but environmentalism itself, the more you began to understand it’s all about them. Any of the environmental websites that you go to, they have clearly and prominently posted how to send them money. Then they tell a few spooky stories about the evildoers, just to get you excited. They remind me of “Brother Loves Traveling Salvation Show” where all you have to do is give them money and you are guaranteed a spot in heaven.

Sadly, there are people that donate millions of dollars to absolute kooks in the name of saving the environment. From the outside looking in, all environmentalists look the same. But if you watch the actions of the people involved you began to notice patterns of not really trying to improve the environment, but, line their own pockets. They swing from trees and act like the monkeys that they are.

Whereas a true environmentalist, like Kym Kemp, will show up at the bargaining table, ready to negotiate for the real things in the environment that are worth saving, and bargain for improvements, and mitigation to more than offset for the damage. She uses her real name and is responsible for the things that she says and does. And, oh by the way, she doesn’t ask you to send her money.

Staff
Member
14 years ago
Reply to  Ernie's Place

Ernie, you’re making me blush. I’m hoping that the Save the Redwoods League just made a little mistake and once they realize the problem will work with us. The sign is situated not far from Steven’s (see above comment) driveway. I foresee picnicers ending up at his house if the sign isn’t removed. The rest of us will lose a view and a sense of shared values in our community. He and his family will lose their privacy.

Ben
Guest
Ben
14 years ago
Reply to  Ernie's Place

How come Ernie gets a smiley face?

Staff
Member
14 years ago
Reply to  Ben

He makes me sound like a saint–I’m susceptible to flattery .

HumboldtBlue
Guest
HumboldtBlue
14 years ago

Completely off topic, but Kym, this photo is right up your alley.

http://pixdaus.com/single.php?id=167298

Staff
Member
14 years ago
Reply to  HumboldtBlue

The mantis looks like she is a black belt. I cracked up.

Staff
Member
14 years ago

Yes, it is really up on the ridge but towards the back side of the loop. I think the property is perfect for them. It helps connect a green belt which is an environmentally sound practice. I believe it has redwoods though I haven’t been on the property. I would love to hike the piece. I’m glad they’re our neighbor. I’m just not happy with the sign.

Staff
Member
14 years ago

The mantis looks like she is a black belt. I cracked up.

Staff
Member
14 years ago

Ernie, you’re making me blush. I’m hoping that the Save the Redwoods League just made a little mistake and once they realize the problem will work with us. The sign is situated not far from Steven’s (see above comment) driveway. I foresee picnicers ending up at his house if the sign isn’t removed. The rest of us will lose a view and a sense of shared values in our community. He and his family will lose their privacy.

Staff
Member
14 years ago

For those of you that asked me what the sign said, here is a transcription:
Corridor from the Redwoods to the Sea
Enhancing Open Space and Wildlife Habitat
A project to improve and protect habitat
Funded in part by the 2000 Park Bonds Act
Arnold Schwarzenegger, Governor
MikeChrisman, secretary for Resources
Save the Redwoods League gratefully acknowledges the following funders
for their instrumental roles in portecting this forest:
California Dept. of Fish and Game
Wildlife Conservation Board
Save the Redwoods League also gratefully acknowledges
the support of the Mattole Community

A Project of
Save-the-Redwoods LEague
Protecting Ancient forests since 1918

NCB State of California
Wildlife Conservation Board

Heather
Guest
14 years ago
Reply to  Staff

This sounds like one of those temporary “project” signs that CalTrans puts up. However, I realize that some “projects” take years & years to complete.
Temporary or not, it is dang ugly, out of place and an inexcusable irony.

Staff
Member
14 years ago
Reply to  Heather

It does seem like a temporary project sign to me too. But there is no project explained. It is weird and I have yet to get an explanation from Save the Redwoods.

max
Guest
max
14 years ago

This is hilarious. I can see an entire movie just about the battle over the sign.

Staff
Member
14 years ago
Reply to  max

Can I be played by Sally Field?

max
Guest
max
14 years ago

This is hilarious. I can see an entire movie just about the battle over the sign.

Staff
Member
14 years ago
Reply to  max

Can I be played by Sally Field?

noise bursts
Guest
14 years ago

Do like the people in Bolinas do, as fast as they can put them up they tear them down.

Staff
Member
14 years ago
Reply to  noise bursts

Well actually….Um, it seems to feeling a little flat at the moment.

noise bursts
Guest
14 years ago

Do like the people in Bolinas do, as fast as they can put them up they tear them down.

Staff
Member
14 years ago
Reply to  noise bursts

Well actually….Um, it seems to feeling a little flat at the moment.

Indie
Guest
14 years ago

If they want to put up an interpretive sign of some kind, why not something in keeping with the environment, something subtle, like a low wooden plaque, rocks, something that harmonizes with the land they’ve decided to protect.

Staff
Member
14 years ago
Reply to  Indie

Exactly!

Indie
Guest
14 years ago

If they want to put up an interpretive sign of some kind, why not something in keeping with the environment, something subtle, like a low wooden plaque, rocks, something that harmonizes with the land they’ve decided to protect.

Staff
Member
14 years ago
Reply to  Indie

Exactly!

max
Guest
max
14 years ago

I was thinking Natalie Portman but I hear she is booked into the next decade.

Staff
Member
14 years ago
Reply to  max

A mere child. We need someone with character lines to play me ’cause I got lots of character.

olmanriver
Guest
olmanriver
14 years ago
Reply to  Staff

julianne moore! ! ! ! ! ! !

Staff
Member
14 years ago
Reply to  olmanriver

I could live with that’>

Ben
Guest
Ben
14 years ago
Reply to  Staff

You redheads all run together.

Kato
Guest
Kato
14 years ago
Reply to  Ben

Why not Susan Sarandon? She’s an activist off-camera and a natural redhead (with enough character)!

max
Guest
max
14 years ago

I was thinking Natalie Portman but I hear she is booked into the next decade.

Staff
Member
14 years ago
Reply to  max

A mere child. We need someone with character lines to play me ’cause I got lots of character.

olmanriver
Guest
olmanriver
14 years ago
Reply to  Staff

julianne moore! ! ! ! ! ! !

Staff
Member
14 years ago
Reply to  olmanriver

I could live with that’>

Ben
Guest
Ben
14 years ago
Reply to  Staff

You redheads all run together.

Kato
Guest
Kato
14 years ago
Reply to  Ben

Why not Susan Sarandon? She’s an activist off-camera and a natural redhead (with enough character)!

tom
Guest
tom
14 years ago

You guys and gals need to settle down. For better or worse we live in an area that has a live and let live attitude. I can’t believe your getting your shorts in a bunch over this, esp. when you would have to drive miles to see it. Also little sign no Richardson grove yes? Let’s keep our priorities straight and send save the redwoods some money for their good work.

tom
Guest
tom
14 years ago

You guys and gals need to settle down. For better or worse we live in an area that has a live and let live attitude. I can’t believe your getting your shorts in a bunch over this, esp. when you would have to drive miles to see it. Also little sign no Richardson grove yes? Let’s keep our priorities straight and send save the redwoods some money for their good work.

Heather
Guest
14 years ago

This sounds like one of those temporary “project” signs that CalTrans puts up. However, I realize that some “projects” take years & years to complete.
Temporary or not, it is dang ugly, out of place and an inexcusable irony.

Staff
Member
14 years ago
Reply to  Heather

It does seem like a temporary project sign to me too. But there is no project explained. It is weird and I have yet to get an explanation from Save the Redwoods.

Steven
Guest
Steven
14 years ago

Who benefits from this sign being here and how?
It seems a bit self-congratulatory; it wasn’t enough to save a tract of wild land from development, but an industrial sign had to be erected to let i-don’t-know-who know that this undeveloped land is undeveloped (except for the sign) because of them.
Do they intend to direct visitors out here? …no roads, no picnic tables, no trails, no bathrooms, no garbage receptacles, no parking, no supervision, no safety infrastructure, no fire protection …etc., etc. etc. …again what is this sign here for?

Steven
Guest
Steven
14 years ago

Who benefits from this sign being here and how?
It seems a bit self-congratulatory; it wasn’t enough to save a tract of wild land from development, but an industrial sign had to be erected to let i-don’t-know-who know that this undeveloped land is undeveloped (except for the sign) because of them.
Do they intend to direct visitors out here? …no roads, no picnic tables, no trails, no bathrooms, no garbage receptacles, no parking, no supervision, no safety infrastructure, no fire protection …etc., etc. etc. …again what is this sign here for?

Staff
Member
14 years ago

Tom, I drive there on a regular basis. I love the loop and all its beauty. I do think this is a serious encroachment into our neighborhood. We have no signs. Now we have one that sprouts up in the middle of a beautiful meadow. All over America, environmentalists are working to rid the communities of the blight of billboards. Let’s not get them started here. Check out the Scenic America link in the post above.

Richardson’s Grove realignment will allow more gas efficient vehicles, more cost effective vehicles and safer access at no long term cost to the environment (it will not effectively change the character of the grove.) This sign will effectively put a huge GOVERNMENT INDUSTRY type brand on our meadows and, as far as I can tell, serves no purpose at all.

We do have a wonderful live and let live attitude here. But explaining to a neighbor how one of their actions is harming you and asking them to reconsider is not unneighborly. In fact, it is the basis of a great communication relationship.

Staff
Member
14 years ago

Tom, I drive there on a regular basis. I love the loop and all its beauty. I do think this is a serious encroachment into our neighborhood. We have no signs. Now we have one that sprouts up in the middle of a beautiful meadow. All over America, environmentalists are working to rid the communities of the blight of billboards. Let’s not get them started here. Check out the Scenic America link in the post above.

Richardson’s Grove realignment will allow more gas efficient vehicles, more cost effective vehicles and safer access at no long term cost to the environment (it will not effectively change the character of the grove.) This sign will effectively put a huge GOVERNMENT INDUSTRY type brand on our meadows and, as far as I can tell, serves no purpose at all.

We do have a wonderful live and let live attitude here. But explaining to a neighbor how one of their actions is harming you and asking them to reconsider is not unneighborly. In fact, it is the basis of a great communication relationship.

Steven
Guest
Steven
14 years ago

8 a.m. and I see the sign was cut down overnight !! (and I do not own a chainsaw, just for the record)

I completely understand the sentiment, however I feel we, as a community, were robbed of an opportunity to resolve this issue by bargaining in good faith with our neighbor.

…Glad its down, wish it had come down under more honorable circumstances.

Steven
Guest
Steven
14 years ago

8 a.m. and I see the sign was cut down overnight !! (and I do not own a chainsaw, just for the record)

I completely understand the sentiment, however I feel we, as a community, were robbed of an opportunity to resolve this issue by bargaining in good faith with our neighbor.

…Glad its down, wish it had come down under more honorable circumstances.

Staff
Member
14 years ago

I believe it went down in the first 24 hours. I went by there yesterday and took photos.

I just got a call from a very nice woman named Jennifer Benito who is the Outreach director for Save the Redwoods. I had left a message there yesterday. She didn’t know even where the sign was and what it was about and is investigating. I was able to give her Cristina Ambrose’s name thanks to you and hopefully, this investigation will lead to a good resolution. I urge everyone to keep calling and leaving emails–letting the League understand that they have inadvertently stepped on our community’s values.

Staff
Member
14 years ago

I believe it went down in the first 24 hours. I went by there yesterday and took photos.

I just got a call from a very nice woman named Jennifer Benito who is the Outreach director for Save the Redwoods. I had left a message there yesterday. She didn’t know even where the sign was and what it was about and is investigating. I was able to give her Cristina Ambrose’s name thanks to you and hopefully, this investigation will lead to a good resolution. I urge everyone to keep calling and leaving emails–letting the League understand that they have inadvertently stepped on our community’s values.

Kato
Guest
Kato
14 years ago

I agree with Max on the hilarity factor, beginning with the ironic choice of pressure-treated posts and a plastic sign. I spoke with Christine Ambrose and she said that posting the sign was a requirment of the grant terms they have with the Wildlife Conservation Board. I suggested they use the bulletin board to post all their information; that’s where people are used to getting updates and info. She’s going to ask if they can post something smaller, but with a map as well. They are very open to input from the community.

The sign was ugly, but expensive. If it showed up down at the bulletin board, it would go a long way towards some mutual respect.

Kato
Guest
Kato
14 years ago

I agree with Max on the hilarity factor, beginning with the ironic choice of pressure-treated posts and a plastic sign. I spoke with Christine Ambrose and she said that posting the sign was a requirment of the grant terms they have with the Wildlife Conservation Board. I suggested they use the bulletin board to post all their information; that’s where people are used to getting updates and info. She’s going to ask if they can post something smaller, but with a map as well. They are very open to input from the community.

The sign was ugly, but expensive. If it showed up down at the bulletin board, it would go a long way towards some mutual respect.

Kato
Guest
Kato
14 years ago

Here’s the map of their plans for this corridor: http://www.ancientforests.org/gb/maps.html

It looks pretty inconvenient for any backpackers to come out and access the trail through here. The whole point will be to go from the redwoods to the coast, so this is unlikely as a destination point.

Ben
Guest
Ben
14 years ago
Reply to  Kato

Thanks for the link. I learned something.

Ben
Guest
Ben
14 years ago
Reply to  Ben

Why does Kato get the smiley face?

Staff
Member
14 years ago
Reply to  Ben

Redheads stick together. She’s sort of a redhead.

Kato
Guest
Kato
14 years ago

Here’s the map of their plans for this corridor: http://www.ancientforests.org/gb/maps.html

It looks pretty inconvenient for any backpackers to come out and access the trail through here. The whole point will be to go from the redwoods to the coast, so this is unlikely as a destination point.

Ben
Guest
Ben
14 years ago
Reply to  Kato

Thanks for the link. I learned something.

Ben
Guest
Ben
14 years ago
Reply to  Ben

Why does Kato get the smiley face?

Staff
Member
14 years ago
Reply to  Ben

Redheads stick together. She’s sort of a redhead.

tom
Guest
tom
14 years ago

So how far are we going to go with this. I know some people did not want their neighbors to have PG&E power and used chain saws to cut the poles down so they can’t have it. If somebody’s house or greenhouse can be seen from the road and somebody thinks it is ugly will they burn it down. I don’t think it reflects well on the community when peoples opinions are enforced by force. It might be a good idea if all you ugly sign people could make donations to save the redwoods league to make up for the cost of replacing the sign. If in the future negotiations lead to a resolution to the sign problem so much the better. To use an act of violence like this to impose the will of some people on other people is just not right and it certainly is not cute. The save the redwoods league put a lookout in grasshopper peak for us. They preserved a ton of redwoods for us, and continue to be one of the most useful environmental organizations that we have. As far as Richardson Grove is concerned. I don’t have $1 billion dollars, and I don’t want to build any giant big-box stores. I don’t particularly want giant trucks, Mexican or American driving through somewhere where they are not particularly wanted.

Ben
Guest
Ben
14 years ago
Reply to  tom

Tom… No poles were cut down… just cut. No chainsaw was used… The Beaver wasn’t a fool. Everyone got their PG&E. You are re writing history. Happens a lot around here.

Staff
Member
14 years ago

Tom,

To lump all the people against the ugly sign together doesn’t work well. Everybody has their own values and needs. Many anti sign people are against chainsawing it down as Steven above indicated.

I personally have supported Save the Redwoods in the past and their cooperative response ( I just got two more calls while I was out this morning indicating that the sign was a requirement of their grant and they were going to ask Wildlife foundation to release them from that stipulation) to our concerns makes me even more likely to in the future. If my neighbor has a concern about something that I do, I appreciate them immediately bringing the problem up and discussing it with me. Together, hopefully, we can reach a compromise that works. It looks like the Save the Redwoods people are working hard to be great neighbors. I hope we all work hard to be good neighbors back.

Staff
Member
14 years ago

Tom,

To lump all the people against the ugly sign together doesn’t work well. Everybody has their own values and needs. Many anti sign people are against chainsawing it down as Steven above indicated.

I personally have supported Save the Redwoods in the past and their cooperative response ( I just got two more calls while I was out this morning indicating that the sign was a requirement of their grant and they were going to ask Wildlife foundation to release them from that stipulation) to our concerns makes me even more likely to in the future. If my neighbor has a concern about something that I do, I appreciate them immediately bringing the problem up and discussing it with me. Together, hopefully, we can reach a compromise that works. It looks like the Save the Redwoods people are working hard to be great neighbors. I hope we all work hard to be good neighbors back.

Ben
Guest
Ben
14 years ago

How come Ernie gets a smiley face?

Staff
Member
14 years ago
Reply to  Ben

He makes me sound like a saint–I’m susceptible to flattery .

Rush Limbaugh
Guest
Rush Limbaugh
14 years ago

But of course we have no problem with automatic weapons, diesel generators, locked gates and armed thugs patrolling our roads.

Ben
Guest
Ben
14 years ago
Reply to  Rush Limbaugh

Rush Limbaugh gets a smiley face? Sheeesh!

Rush Limbaugh
Guest
Rush Limbaugh
14 years ago

But of course we have no problem with automatic weapons, diesel generators, locked gates and armed thugs patrolling our roads.

Ben
Guest
Ben
14 years ago
Reply to  Rush Limbaugh

Rush Limbaugh gets a smiley face? Sheeesh!

suzy blah blah
Guest
suzy blah blah
14 years ago

8 a.m. and I see the sign was cut down overnight !! (and I do not own a chainsaw, just for the record)
I completely understand the sentiment,

yeah i understand the sentiment too –the person who cut the sign is total self-righteous asshole and hypocrite as well. Suzy calls it playing god with chainsaw..

suzy blah blah
Guest
suzy blah blah
14 years ago

8 a.m. and I see the sign was cut down overnight !! (and I do not own a chainsaw, just for the record)
I completely understand the sentiment,

yeah i understand the sentiment too –the person who cut the sign is total self-righteous asshole and hypocrite as well. Suzy calls it playing god with chainsaw..

Staff
Member
14 years ago

Beloved readers,

At the risk of seeming preachy, I’m going to speak from my heart here.

I know that whenever there is controversy, there is a tendency to vilify people that believe differently than us. Please take a moment before you post and remember that the person who does something that you totally disagree with on one position may be the hero who steps forward and saves the day in another. Using names and labels isn’t conducive to working together to solve our communities’ problems.

Once someone has been called a name, they are likely to label you with a similar name and communication breaks down. Condemn the act, if it offends you. Not the person.

Staff
Member
14 years ago

Beloved readers,

At the risk of seeming preachy, I’m going to speak from my heart here.

I know that whenever there is controversy, there is a tendency to vilify people that believe differently than us. Please take a moment before you post and remember that the person who does something that you totally disagree with on one position may be the hero who steps forward and saves the day in another. Using names and labels isn’t conducive to working together to solve our communities’ problems.

Once someone has been called a name, they are likely to label you with a similar name and communication breaks down. Condemn the act, if it offends you. Not the person.

suzy blah blah
Guest
suzy blah blah
14 years ago

At the risk of seeming preachy..

well its your blog so that gives you the right to be preachy and say how one ought to express their opinions, i guess. Same old story, its about control, that’s the underlying problem in both instances, the fear of not being in control. The scapegoat may end up being a sign that has to go or it may be a blog commenter that has to be censured. Everywhere a merciless fight for this social resource is raging behind the facade of polite manners and correct standards of behavior. ( tsk tsk)

suzy blah blah
Guest
suzy blah blah
14 years ago

At the risk of seeming preachy..

well its your blog so that gives you the right to be preachy and say how one ought to express their opinions, i guess. Same old story, its about control, that’s the underlying problem in both instances, the fear of not being in control. The scapegoat may end up being a sign that has to go or it may be a blog commenter that has to be censured. Everywhere a merciless fight for this social resource is raging behind the facade of polite manners and correct standards of behavior. ( tsk tsk)

Staff
Member
14 years ago

Suzy,

Your commentary makes me laugh aloud almost always (or grips me and makes me think at other times so in no way do I want you to feel unwelcome. I don’t mind controversial opinions or telling me I’m completely off my rocker. (well, I try not to mind, anyway.)

However, I used to quit reading the comments on Eric’s old blog after the first few because the conversation degenerated into name calling and nothing was being said. Plus, I think people became hardened into positions.

It has been my experience that people are most open to change if one approaches them like they are reasonable people–not calling them names.

In other words, go right ahead and say you don’t think chainsawing the sign down is a great idea. I’m just asking that words like asshole be used rarely if ever. I’m not censoring your ideas. I’m asking you to express them without name calling and, when appropriate, backed up with facts.