Double Homicide in Kettenpom–Two Neighbors Injured, Suspect Killed

 

UPDATE 6: I have posted a memorial page for Christopher Sky Richardson here.

UPDATE 5: Tomas Gouverneur’s fiance has denied that Kristine Constantino was a former girlfriend of his.

UPDATE 4: I have just posted a new summary of all the credible evidence here. Please let me know if you have other information in the comment section. I will amend as necessary.

UPDATE 3: I have incorrectly spelled the name of the first responders who were injured. Their last name is Gund.

UPDATE 2:  the driver of the vehicle was identified as Tomas Pitagoras Gouverneur 32 years of age. Tomas showed addresses in San Francisco, California as well as in the State of Oregon. This may be a picture of him here (scroll down to page 3 where he is tutoring a student) but although this name is unusual and the person is in Oregon and of approximately the correct age, this may not be him.

According to the Press Democrat, “[the] Kettenpom woman who suffered stab wounds in the attack in Kettenpom Valley had been flown to UC Davis Medical Center to be treated for her injuries, Palmer said. [the] man who was stabbed was treated at a Garberville hospital and released, he said.

UPDATE:I’ve been asked to reassure folks that the heroic first responders, Jim and Norma Gunn, were wounded but recovering.

In the hills of eastern Humboldt and southwestern Trinity County two people died yesterday and two more were injured in what is rumored to be a jealous ex-boyfriend’s revenge.  According to sources, the Oregon man slit the throats of his ex-girlfriend and her current boyfriend.  When older neighbors came to investigate, he stabbed them and escaped.  The two injured neighbors managed to call for help and drive to the tiny town of Kettenpom where they were transported to Garberville Hospital for medical treatment.

Trinity Sheriff’s Dept. say that at 4:45 yesterday afternoon, 911 received a call from a woman on her cell phone asking for help.  In rapid succession they got more calls from the Kettenpom store describing a dramatic scene in which two victims had been stabbed and driven themselves through the hills to the tiny hamlet to get help.  As the deputies made the hour long drive to the furthest corners of their county (Kettenpom is over 2 hours from the county seat of Weaverville not far from Mendocino County) they learned that there were two more victims–fatalities–inside a home. The victims were able to describe the murderer’s vehicle (teal green with Oregon license plates) and law enforcement subsequently issued an alert describing a bearded white man possibly carrying a stun gun driving a 4 door Subaru.

Mendocino Sheriff’s Dept. sent the following press release.

On 3-13-2011 at approximately 1820 the  Mendocino County Sheriffs Office received an agency assist “be on the look out” bulletin from Trinity County Sheriffs Department regarding a double homicide.

Trinity County Sheriffs Office advised they had an outstanding suspect, who was responsible for a double fatal stabbing, flee Trinity County at approximately 1700 and a possible route of travel would be Mina Road en route to Highway 162 through Covelo,Ca.  ….

Deputies left the Willits area en route to Covelo via Highway 162.  At approximately 1845 deputies were driving on Highway 162 towards Covelo.  At approximately mile post marker ten (10) they parked their car so they could see the roadway and anyone traveling along its path.  Soon after parking along the road, they observed the listed suspect, who fit the suspect description as well as the suspect vehicle, pass them and continue driving West on Highway 162.

Deputies initiated their emergency lights in an attempt to make a vehicle stop.  The suspect failed to yield and a pursuit was initiated.

Mendocino County Sheriffs Deputies requested the assistance of Willits Police Department and the California Highway Patrol.  Deputies followed the suspect at speeds ranging from 60 to 90 miles per hour.  The suspect then turned south onto Highway 101 towards Willits,California with a single sheriffs unit continuing the pursuit.  At approximately Mile Marker 54 near Appliance Lane,which is north of Willits,California, the suspect lost control of his vehicle and struck a large oak tree.

Deputies responded to the wrecked vehicle along with medical personnel and observed the suspect had succumbed to injuries received from the accident.

The California Highway Patrol conducted the accident investigation and Trinity County is continuing their investigation into the suspect drivers involvement with the double homicide in their county.

A forensic Autopsy will be conducted on the decedent later in the week.

Authorities are attempting to locate the decedent’s next of kin prior to releasing his name.

According to the Redding Searchlight,

The stabbings were the talk of southern Trinity County, where even distant neighbors know each other by first name.

Norma Johnson, who lives 40 minutes from Kettenpom in the Ruth Lake area, said she knew one of the survivors. She declined to provide the woman’s name.

Johnson and her husband, Lyle, listened on their police scanner as the crisis unfolded.

“I know two people’s throats were slit,” Johnson said.

Southern Trinity County has become so lawless that Johnson and her husband don’t leave the house without carrying guns, she said. Should she or her neighbors call 911, it’s likely going to be at least an hour before a deputy shows up.

“We pack all the time,” Johnson said. “We have no law enforcement.”

  • Laytonville Rock
Facebooktwittergoogle_pluspinterestmail

280 comments

    • Tomas had a soul and a heart.

      What I would like to hear are some fact about what happened, first person witness accounts. Not the hearsay of second hand small town gossip.

      • We would all like to have some questions answered. One thing everyone should try to understand is that people who you might otherwise love and respect sometimes do bad, very bad things. It is really hard to believe. Often we want to blame other people because we can’t believe the story. Go ahead ask the questions, try and get them answered but also try and remember that other people are hurting and frustrated too. Please try to take the time to phrase your questions and frustrations in a way that you will encourage people to help you rather than drive them away.

      • Yea, me too, but investigations take time. Although in a newer thread taylor gives an account relayed to her by her father (one of the survivors).

      • Right, because the word of the sheriff’s department is small-town gossip. Where else do you expect to get facts? I am sorry a good friend of yours died, but please don’t attack objective sources who are producing facts, not heartfelt sentiments about what a great guy the suspect was.

    • Tomas had a soul and a heart.

      What I would like to hear are some fact about what happened, first person witness accounts. Not the hearsay of second hand small town gossip.

      • We would all like to have some questions answered. One thing everyone should try to understand is that people who you might otherwise love and respect sometimes do bad, very bad things. It is really hard to believe. Often we want to blame other people because we can’t believe the story. Go ahead ask the questions, try and get them answered but also try and remember that other people are hurting and frustrated too. Please try to take the time to phrase your questions and frustrations in a way that you will encourage people to help you rather than drive them away.

      • Yea, me too, but investigations take time. Although in a newer thread taylor gives an account relayed to her by her father (one of the survivors).

      • Right, because the word of the sheriff’s department is small-town gossip. Where else do you expect to get facts? I am sorry a good friend of yours died, but please don’t attack objective sources who are producing facts, not heartfelt sentiments about what a great guy the suspect was.

  • I notice the sensationalistic quote is used to end to article without any mention of the AWESOME community 1st responders that saved the life of one of the victims under horrendous weather conditions. The community of Kettenpom is FAR from lawless and it is irresponsible to throw around unfounded quotes like these.

  • I notice the sensationalistic quote is used to end to article without any mention of the AWESOME community 1st responders that saved the life of one of the victims under horrendous weather conditions. The community of Kettenpom is FAR from lawless and it is irresponsible to throw around unfounded quotes like these.

  • Cara,

    I would love to hear about the first responders. Can you tell us more? Unfortunately, I can only report what I can find out either from sources like you or online sources like the Searchlight. Please tell us any great stuff about the wonderful volunteers and workers that staff our local emergency services. They are often amazing and selfless people who work long hard hours for little or no pay.

  • Cara,

    I would love to hear about the first responders. Can you tell us more? Unfortunately, I can only report what I can find out either from sources like you or online sources like the Searchlight. Please tell us any great stuff about the wonderful volunteers and workers that staff our local emergency services. They are often amazing and selfless people who work long hard hours for little or no pay.

  • Gund, not Gunn.

  • Gund, not Gunn.

  • I’d be interested to know the source for the rumor “In the hills of eastern Humboldt and southwestern Trinity County two people died yesterday and two more were injured in what is rumored to be a jealous ex-boyfriend’s revenge.  According to sources, the Oregon man slit the throats of his ex-girlfriend and her current boyfriend.  When older neighbors came to investigate, he stabbed them and escaped.”

    • Several readers have talked to me or called me about the situation. They seemed to know what they were talking about. But, I can only say that this is the rumor which I am hearing (I believed it credible and important in that rumors of marijuana crimes usually follow any violence. Normally, since the rumor isn’t substantiated, I would have kept silence but, because it was credible and because it might help quell fears, I published it.. I have no actual way of checking the facts. That he was an ex-boyfriend has not been proven.

  • I’d be interested to know the source for the rumor “In the hills of eastern Humboldt and southwestern Trinity County two people died yesterday and two more were injured in what is rumored to be a jealous ex-boyfriend’s revenge.  According to sources, the Oregon man slit the throats of his ex-girlfriend and her current boyfriend.  When older neighbors came to investigate, he stabbed them and escaped.”

    • Several readers have talked to me or called me about the situation. They seemed to know what they were talking about. But, I can only say that this is the rumor which I am hearing (I believed it credible and important in that rumors of marijuana crimes usually follow any violence. Normally, since the rumor isn’t substantiated, I would have kept silence but, because it was credible and because it might help quell fears, I published it.. I have no actual way of checking the facts. That he was an ex-boyfriend has not been proven.

  • Friend of a Friend

    I know Tomas’ family on the East Coast, and am curious if your local news has reported any more on this? Tomas was happily engaged and very much in love, and was additionally known for his love of life and big heart. This just doesn’t add up with that picture, and I certainly can’t imagine him acting out of jealousy when he was so happy with his finace. Any chance that you’ve heard of a different motive?

    • None of the media outlets I’ve seen (and I have been reading up on this) have attributed any motive to Tomas. The girl who was murdered wasn’t well known by the people I’ve talked to. But the rumors I have heard say she used to be Tomas girlfriend and her name was Cristina. So far the victim’s names haven’t gone out to the media that I know of. But perhaps the name Cristina will ring a bell and will help Tomas’s family make some sense of what happened?

    • What did Tomas do for a living? Everything I read omits his occupation. Might he have been involved in illegal activity?

  • Friend of a Friend

    I know Tomas’ family on the East Coast, and am curious if your local news has reported any more on this? Tomas was happily engaged and very much in love, and was additionally known for his love of life and big heart. This just doesn’t add up with that picture, and I certainly can’t imagine him acting out of jealousy when he was so happy with his finace. Any chance that you’ve heard of a different motive?

    • None of the media outlets I’ve seen (and I have been reading up on this) have attributed any motive to Tomas. The girl who was murdered wasn’t well known by the people I’ve talked to. But the rumors I have heard say she used to be Tomas girlfriend and her name was Cristina. So far the victim’s names haven’t gone out to the media that I know of. But perhaps the name Cristina will ring a bell and will help Tomas’s family make some sense of what happened?

    • What did Tomas do for a living? Everything I read omits his occupation. Might he have been involved in illegal activity?

  • http://www.redding.com/news/2011/mar/14/2-murdered-2-stabbed-trinity-county/ has some comments that sound like they come from neighbors and friends that might be interesting to you.

    • Friend of a Friend

      Thanks for the links and for any additional info that you come across, this is incredibly distressing to all that know the family and only ever knew Tomas as a loving, kind soul.

      • There is no way that this is correct. Tomás was one of the sweetest people I have ever met. I have known him for 13 years. Pinning this crime on him will only leave a killer on the loose. Anybody who ever loved Tomás knows that he isn’t capable of anything remotely close to violence. If there was ever any issue, he would have talked it out & left with a hug.

        My thoughts are with the victims & my dear friend.

        • if you only knew

          No one would believe it if I told them the violent act I commited, was arrested for, and plead guilty to. It was not self defense. NO ONE. I am a petite woman, quiet and shy, a mother. So YOU NEVER KNOW. Ever. what someone is capable of in certain situations.

          • If you only knew,

            Thank you. I’ve been struggling to say something meaningful to such heartfelt words. After erasing my comment several times, I just want to say I appreciate you speaking up.

            • Interested in the facts.

              I find it distressing to hear that the body of Tomas has already been cremated with out being IDed by any family or loved ones. In a situation like this, I would demand to see the body. Since that is no longer a reality, the state should be held accountable. A motion like that, with out some sort of legal document saying that was his request seems to hinder rights of the family.

              • A cremated body doesn’t show taser marks.

                This stinks like a pile of week old fish. Two kind gentle youngmen, dead, and unable to speak their own truth, are gone. The stories from LE are conflicting and have yet to be clarified.

              • Where did you get the information that Tomas has already been cremated? If true, that feels wrong.

                • From your blog Ms. K.

                • Amil, someone commented that it was true but information that folk have sent me doesn’t seem to bear this out. Plus the interview with Tomas fiance in the Gazette Times after picking up his body makes no mention of what would appear to be a critical issue. I think the person who placed it here is incorrect.

            • An old ex and friend of tomas

              I also cannot believe that Tomas did this. Why would he go into a jealous rage over an ex when he was so happily engaged? I think this has been either pinned on him and he was terrified & ran, or it was in self defense. Anyone who knows him will tell you he is not capable of hurting anyone like this intentionally. I hope the investigation continues, and we figure out what REALLY happened.

  • http://www.redding.com/news/2011/mar/14/2-murdered-2-stabbed-trinity-county/ has some comments that sound like they come from neighbors and friends that might be interesting to you.

    • Friend of a Friend

      Thanks for the links and for any additional info that you come across, this is incredibly distressing to all that know the family and only ever knew Tomas as a loving, kind soul.

      • There is no way that this is correct. Tomás was one of the sweetest people I have ever met. I have known him for 13 years. Pinning this crime on him will only leave a killer on the loose. Anybody who ever loved Tomás knows that he isn’t capable of anything remotely close to violence. If there was ever any issue, he would have talked it out & left with a hug.

        My thoughts are with the victims & my dear friend.

        • if you only knew

          No one would believe it if I told them the violent act I commited, was arrested for, and plead guilty to. It was not self defense. NO ONE. I am a petite woman, quiet and shy, a mother. So YOU NEVER KNOW. Ever. what someone is capable of in certain situations.

          • If you only knew,

            Thank you. I’ve been struggling to say something meaningful to such heartfelt words. After erasing my comment several times, I just want to say I appreciate you speaking up.

            • Interested in the facts.

              I find it distressing to hear that the body of Tomas has already been cremated with out being IDed by any family or loved ones. In a situation like this, I would demand to see the body. Since that is no longer a reality, the state should be held accountable. A motion like that, with out some sort of legal document saying that was his request seems to hinder rights of the family.

              • A cremated body doesn’t show taser marks.

                This stinks like a pile of week old fish. Two kind gentle youngmen, dead, and unable to speak their own truth, are gone. The stories from LE are conflicting and have yet to be clarified.

              • Where did you get the information that Tomas has already been cremated? If true, that feels wrong.

                • From your blog Ms. K.

                • Amil, someone commented that it was true but information that folk have sent me doesn’t seem to bear this out. Plus the interview with Tomas fiance in the Gazette Times after picking up his body makes no mention of what would appear to be a critical issue. I think the person who placed it here is incorrect.

            • An old ex and friend of tomas

              I also cannot believe that Tomas did this. Why would he go into a jealous rage over an ex when he was so happily engaged? I think this has been either pinned on him and he was terrified & ran, or it was in self defense. Anyone who knows him will tell you he is not capable of hurting anyone like this intentionally. I hope the investigation continues, and we figure out what REALLY happened.

  • as the daughter of one of the victims let me tell you, you never know someone. your friend tomas tried to take the life of my father, his wife and took the life of two young homesteading people. I am so thankful my Dad at the age of 60 was in shape and able to fight down this lost soul. may God send him where he belongs.

    • Tayler,
      Unless you were there and knew who Tomas was, what you are saying is just inane.

      Anyone who ever met Tomas knows that no one could ever mistake him for a 6′ tall 200lb guy.

      This reeks of some sort of framing typical of the Nor-cal F-ed up LE and pot culture.

      Unfortunately with the LE and news reporting you are stuck with down there we’ll likely never know.

      Hopefully the real criminal is apprehended soon.

      • I love that someone else believes Mas ISN”T THE KILLER

        • Witness accounts don’t mesh with the stories the cops are telling. Four victims, two fatal, two houses a car chase and according to this sites blogger/reporter a drug deal. Oh and a mystery man. I wonder what will happen to these stories when the investigation moves north? What would happen to the witness stories if Tomas was put in OR at the time of the fallen tree sighting? And if its a dope deal, where is the dope and or the money? It all sounds too convenient.

          But ya gotta admire anyone who was tazed twenty times had his throat slit and was able to drive a car. And who was the other witness that also had a slit throat and drove a car? Or were these reports in error?

          Lots more questions than answers. The silence is deafening. I can hear crickets.

          • Amil, I did not suggest that this was a drug deal. I have not heard any credible rumors to that effect.

          • Kettenpom Store

            I co-own the Kettenpom Store with my wife. I was here and yes both of the surviving victims drove to our store. My employee and a local patron were in the store when the first victim arrived at the store and had a huge slit on her throat. The cut had penetrated her airway but had somehow not cut through the major arteries. She was able to vocalize to some extent but it was pretty dramatic to hear her voice coming out of her mouth and the slit in her throat.
            I asked her who had done this to her. She told me that he looked normal but that he was “BAD.”
            She told me he was going to kill her husband and where they were at. She wrote a note when talking became too much for her.
            I called 911 to get help on the way for her.
            Then I left the store armed and with a good friend and closest neighbor to see if we could save her husband.
            As we made the short drive to their house we saw the second victim pulling out of his driveway. His wounds were more superficial and it was clear his life was not in danger. He told us more what the guy looked like and what he was driving. He went to the store to check on his wife and to receive some treatment himself.
            We continued down the road to see if we could find the suspect. Upon pulling partway down the long driveway we could see that the car was not any longer at the residence. We turned around and returned to the store to make sure the suspect didn’t go to the store and to make more calls to try to ensure that this car didn’t make it out of the area.
            There are basically three routes of travel out of here. Once it was realized that two out of three routes were covered by people who responded and were looking for the suspect car that really only left the Mina Rd. as the possible escape route.
            A Sheriff spotted the suspect car two hours after the attacks which is the right amount of time it would take for the suspect to get to that location.
            The car didn’t stop. The man who was driving the car has been positively identified as the attacker by one of the survivors.
            The guy they caught is/was THE murderer…. Is he your Mas???? I don’t know… Stolen identity??? Where is your Mas? Has the family of your Mas been notified. Have they identified this body? Did this guy kill your Mas and take his ID, car, ect. I don’t know…
            After all of this I am reminded that anything is possible.
            I hope that your Mas is alive and well, he sounds like a good person. I hope that you are right and that he didn’t do all of this.

            The day that this happened was a terrible stormy day and our community did an amazing job with this extreme situation. Remote location… Radio traffic… Radio signal… No power… One of our own. You guys were up against a ton of adversity. Special thanks to everyone who was here and helped all the way from the local citizens, KZVFD, Star, and TCSO. I am proud to be a part of this far from lawless community.

        • Well liked in the area.

          I just don’t believe our dear friend Mas is responsible for such a random act of violence. For all those who knew Mas, please feel free to help inform these people of who he was.

          • i’m sure you all think he’s a nice guy, but i’m more interested in the facts of the case. The store owner’s account is great and holds more weight than comments from dear friends. I am sorry your friend died, but remember, two people were brutally murdered.

            • Mr. Gund drove to the home where the assaults took place. At some point after he witnessed his wifes assault and experienced numerous tasings he returned to his own home, whilst his wife drove to the store.

              The storekeepers story merely prompts more questions. It would be nice if LE gave a cogent explaination of the events.

              • Kettenpom Store

                What questions do you have?
                Yes Jim and Norma drove to the residence. Both were assaulted. Norma managed to get to the truck and drive to my store in it.
                Jim was able to wrestle the knife from the guy (he said he still felt at a disadvantage) and retreat the few hundred yards back to his home where he got one of his other vehicles and also came up to our store. We passed him at the end of his driveway like I said before.
                The DOJ took both vehicles in the middle of the night on flatbeds.

                I do agree that I wish the LE would step forward and answer some of these other questions. I do find it very interesting that the suspect and one of the victims have known each other for years?

      • Well liked in the area.

        Mas was much bigger than 6 foot and weighed more than 200lbs.

  • as the daughter of one of the victims let me tell you, you never know someone. your friend tomas tried to take the life of my father, his wife and took the life of two young homesteading people. I am so thankful my Dad at the age of 60 was in shape and able to fight down this lost soul. may God send him where he belongs.

    • Tayler,
      Unless you were there and knew who Tomas was, what you are saying is just inane.

      Anyone who ever met Tomas knows that no one could ever mistake him for a 6′ tall 200lb guy.

      This reeks of some sort of framing typical of the Nor-cal F-ed up LE and pot culture.

      Unfortunately with the LE and news reporting you are stuck with down there we’ll likely never know.

      Hopefully the real criminal is apprehended soon.

      • I love that someone else believes Mas ISN”T THE KILLER

        • Witness accounts don’t mesh with the stories the cops are telling. Four victims, two fatal, two houses a car chase and according to this sites blogger/reporter a drug deal. Oh and a mystery man. I wonder what will happen to these stories when the investigation moves north? What would happen to the witness stories if Tomas was put in OR at the time of the fallen tree sighting? And if its a dope deal, where is the dope and or the money? It all sounds too convenient.

          But ya gotta admire anyone who was tazed twenty times had his throat slit and was able to drive a car. And who was the other witness that also had a slit throat and drove a car? Or were these reports in error?

          Lots more questions than answers. The silence is deafening. I can hear crickets.

          • Amil, I did not suggest that this was a drug deal. I have not heard any credible rumors to that effect.

          • Kettenpom Store

            I co-own the Kettenpom Store with my wife. I was here and yes both of the surviving victims drove to our store. My employee and a local patron were in the store when the first victim arrived at the store and had a huge slit on her throat. The cut had penetrated her airway but had somehow not cut through the major arteries. She was able to vocalize to some extent but it was pretty dramatic to hear her voice coming out of her mouth and the slit in her throat.
            I asked her who had done this to her. She told me that he looked normal but that he was “BAD.”
            She told me he was going to kill her husband and where they were at. She wrote a note when talking became too much for her.
            I called 911 to get help on the way for her.
            Then I left the store armed and with a good friend and closest neighbor to see if we could save her husband.
            As we made the short drive to their house we saw the second victim pulling out of his driveway. His wounds were more superficial and it was clear his life was not in danger. He told us more what the guy looked like and what he was driving. He went to the store to check on his wife and to receive some treatment himself.
            We continued down the road to see if we could find the suspect. Upon pulling partway down the long driveway we could see that the car was not any longer at the residence. We turned around and returned to the store to make sure the suspect didn’t go to the store and to make more calls to try to ensure that this car didn’t make it out of the area.
            There are basically three routes of travel out of here. Once it was realized that two out of three routes were covered by people who responded and were looking for the suspect car that really only left the Mina Rd. as the possible escape route.
            A Sheriff spotted the suspect car two hours after the attacks which is the right amount of time it would take for the suspect to get to that location.
            The car didn’t stop. The man who was driving the car has been positively identified as the attacker by one of the survivors.
            The guy they caught is/was THE murderer…. Is he your Mas???? I don’t know… Stolen identity??? Where is your Mas? Has the family of your Mas been notified. Have they identified this body? Did this guy kill your Mas and take his ID, car, ect. I don’t know…
            After all of this I am reminded that anything is possible.
            I hope that your Mas is alive and well, he sounds like a good person. I hope that you are right and that he didn’t do all of this.

            The day that this happened was a terrible stormy day and our community did an amazing job with this extreme situation. Remote location… Radio traffic… Radio signal… No power… One of our own. You guys were up against a ton of adversity. Special thanks to everyone who was here and helped all the way from the local citizens, KZVFD, Star, and TCSO. I am proud to be a part of this far from lawless community.

        • Well liked in the area.

          I just don’t believe our dear friend Mas is responsible for such a random act of violence. For all those who knew Mas, please feel free to help inform these people of who he was.

          • i’m sure you all think he’s a nice guy, but i’m more interested in the facts of the case. The store owner’s account is great and holds more weight than comments from dear friends. I am sorry your friend died, but remember, two people were brutally murdered.

            • Mr. Gund drove to the home where the assaults took place. At some point after he witnessed his wifes assault and experienced numerous tasings he returned to his own home, whilst his wife drove to the store.

              The storekeepers story merely prompts more questions. It would be nice if LE gave a cogent explaination of the events.

              • Kettenpom Store

                What questions do you have?
                Yes Jim and Norma drove to the residence. Both were assaulted. Norma managed to get to the truck and drive to my store in it.
                Jim was able to wrestle the knife from the guy (he said he still felt at a disadvantage) and retreat the few hundred yards back to his home where he got one of his other vehicles and also came up to our store. We passed him at the end of his driveway like I said before.
                The DOJ took both vehicles in the middle of the night on flatbeds.

                I do agree that I wish the LE would step forward and answer some of these other questions. I do find it very interesting that the suspect and one of the victims have known each other for years?

      • Well liked in the area.

        Mas was much bigger than 6 foot and weighed more than 200lbs.

  • Please tell your dad he has the respect and admiration of everyone who has spoken with me.

  • Please tell your dad he has the respect and admiration of everyone who has spoken with me.

  • Can anyone confirm that the photo is of Tomas Gouverneur?

  • Can anyone confirm that the photo is of Tomas Gouverneur?

  • Pingback: Why Call My Dad? Asks Victim’s Daughter in the Kettenpom Murder Case « REDHEADED BLACKBELT

  • Pingback: Why Call My Dad? Asks Victim’s Daughter in the Kettenpom Murder Case « REDHEADED BLACKBELT

  • I wanna know how anyone could look in Mas’ Eyes and see no soul….I can’t believe he is truly the killer here…

    http://kymkemp.com/2011/03/16/why-call-my-dad-asks-victims-daughter-in-the-kettenpom-murder-case/

  • I wanna know how anyone could look in Mas’ Eyes and see no soul….I can’t believe he is truly the killer here…

    http://kymkemp.com/2011/03/16/why-call-my-dad-asks-victims-daughter-in-the-kettenpom-murder-case/

  • http://www.redding.com/news/2011/mar/14/2-murdered-2-stabbed-trinity-county/

    Jessica27frmZenia writes:
    I grew up 2 min from where this horable crime took place. I have been close personal friends with the two people who were attacked for years. The crime took place down a long road/driveway that used to be the old airport for zenia and kettenpom. My sister in law met the man who did this a couple weeks ago when my brother was trying to remove a tree that had fallen in the road. The man was acting strange ad as soon as my brother was able to move the tree just a bit the man went around him and sped off. My concern is when this took place, there were TWO men in that car. One blond and one dark haired man.
    My prayers are with the two honest hard working people who were injured during this tragedy while trying to help. That is what zenia and kettenpom is all about, we help eachother and yes we do know eachother by first name because we are a tight community. I am very proud to have grown up in this area and I would raise my children there without a secont thought. Nothing like this has ever happened in my lifetime anyway. I am praying for you guys.. JESSICA

  • http://www.redding.com/news/2011/mar/14/2-murdered-2-stabbed-trinity-county/

    Jessica27frmZenia writes:
    I grew up 2 min from where this horable crime took place. I have been close personal friends with the two people who were attacked for years. The crime took place down a long road/driveway that used to be the old airport for zenia and kettenpom. My sister in law met the man who did this a couple weeks ago when my brother was trying to remove a tree that had fallen in the road. The man was acting strange ad as soon as my brother was able to move the tree just a bit the man went around him and sped off. My concern is when this took place, there were TWO men in that car. One blond and one dark haired man.
    My prayers are with the two honest hard working people who were injured during this tragedy while trying to help. That is what zenia and kettenpom is all about, we help eachother and yes we do know eachother by first name because we are a tight community. I am very proud to have grown up in this area and I would raise my children there without a secont thought. Nothing like this has ever happened in my lifetime anyway. I am praying for you guys.. JESSICA

    • fromKettenpomInHawaii

      I would like to apologise as I should have chosen my words a little more carefully. My brother and sister in law live in this area and lkike I have mentioned before, everybody does know everybody by first name in ythis small secluded community. When the people were seen on the road my brother and sis in law knew they were not from this area, and the plates on the car they seen were out of state plates. Is it possable that another car matching the description of the car “mas” was driving with out of state plates is the car my brother saw on the road? yes it is possable. Is it possable that the driver of that car on the road that day matched the description of “mas”? Yes it is possable. Is my brother SURE who he and my sis an law saw on that road that day WAS “THE MURDERER”? NO
      We ARE sure that the people they saw were NOT from zenia/kettenpom, and there were TWO people in that car. The driver of that car that day wouldnt even look at my sis in law when she told them they were trying to help by moving the tree so they could get through. The passenger made eye contact and said ok. Then like I said without another word sped by when he(brother) was able to move it just enough for them to get through. After they drove off my brother continued to move the tree out of the road and proceeded when he thought it was safe for everybody. The people were suspicious to him and he remembered this event because it was out of the ordinary. Again, are all of the the questions I asked “Possable”? Yes

  • I would like to respond to two things.
    First I want to touch on what Cara said about the volunteers. This group of men and woman dedicate their time and energy to bettering our community both medically and with support and help from one another. True the closest deputy is usually hours away, however that does not mean that this is a “lawless” community. Everyone has each others backs and there in times of need at a phone call. The surviving victims are an amazing couple who put the safety of their neighbors in need before their own. This is commendable and it is so tragic they were caught up in such a horrific even.
    Second I want to say something about the “suspect”. He has been positively identified as the attacker by one of the survivors. There is not a chance that this is another example of “the Nor-cal F-up LE” as far as that goes. We know nothing of who or what Tomas was other than what happened here in our small community. If he truly was an outstanding citizen, this was a very interesting and horrible way to show it. I pray for the families of both the deceased victims as well as that of Tomas. This is just so surreal and I am sure there are many questions and a lot of confusion. What we know as fact is that three people are dead and two more injured, with no concrete reason why. ..

    • I’d be looking at the bank accounts of some locals if this crime is supposedly drug related.

      I’m old and I’m not crazy. Mas couldn’t kill a mouse no less taze someone twenty times after slitting the throats of three people.

      But I can understand that the locals need to pay their bills, and small communities will never bite the hands that feed. Its just too bad they couldn’t get their stories straight.

      • Amil,
        Attacking the community that has just lost 2 people and injured 2 more respected people isn’t helping. Most people would want to find out the truth and would be willing to listen to questions and help you answer them. Please speak respectfully being mindful that people are very sad and full of anger here, too.

        • I’m sorry that you mistake my sarcasm for anger. I can see this could turn into a circle the wagons locals only game, rather than an honest reflection on the conflicting accounts of the eye witness/victims. It is understandable that you are defensive with regards to your community, and its loss. But honestly, there’s no anger in my bringing forth the conflicting tales presented here.

        • Sorry, but I think something is rotten inside this ‘community’, and I think Tomas was another victim of whatever sordid thing happened there. And I sincerely hope some outside authorities are brought it.

          Who typically carries tazers? And what reason might Tomas have had for running from the police? Maybe because he had just witnessed them tazing and stabbing people?

      • if you only knew

        Having crossed the threshold into madness during an arguement and having watched someone else do it too, you go into shock. You are not you. You are a lunatic. Doesn’t mean you are that in your soul. doesnt’ mean you can’t come back. But if you go to far, you lose touch, your soul fragments. Trust me on this. You never want to know from personal experiences. So if he was the kind loving person you say he was, fine, he was. But something happened and he lost control, lost touch with himself. Poor soul. The horror of going to the dark side. I have compassion for everyone involved, including him. I pray for healing for everyone.
        My thoughts to Kettenpom. Kudos to the first responders and to the store, a place of refuge.

  • I would like to respond to two things.
    First I want to touch on what Cara said about the volunteers. This group of men and woman dedicate their time and energy to bettering our community both medically and with support and help from one another. True the closest deputy is usually hours away, however that does not mean that this is a “lawless” community. Everyone has each others backs and there in times of need at a phone call. The surviving victims are an amazing couple who put the safety of their neighbors in need before their own. This is commendable and it is so tragic they were caught up in such a horrific even.
    Second I want to say something about the “suspect”. He has been positively identified as the attacker by one of the survivors. There is not a chance that this is another example of “the Nor-cal F-up LE” as far as that goes. We know nothing of who or what Tomas was other than what happened here in our small community. If he truly was an outstanding citizen, this was a very interesting and horrible way to show it. I pray for the families of both the deceased victims as well as that of Tomas. This is just so surreal and I am sure there are many questions and a lot of confusion. What we know as fact is that three people are dead and two more injured, with no concrete reason why. ..

    • I’d be looking at the bank accounts of some locals if this crime is supposedly drug related.

      I’m old and I’m not crazy. Mas couldn’t kill a mouse no less taze someone twenty times after slitting the throats of three people.

      But I can understand that the locals need to pay their bills, and small communities will never bite the hands that feed. Its just too bad they couldn’t get their stories straight.

      • Amil,
        Attacking the community that has just lost 2 people and injured 2 more respected people isn’t helping. Most people would want to find out the truth and would be willing to listen to questions and help you answer them. Please speak respectfully being mindful that people are very sad and full of anger here, too.

        • I’m sorry that you mistake my sarcasm for anger. I can see this could turn into a circle the wagons locals only game, rather than an honest reflection on the conflicting accounts of the eye witness/victims. It is understandable that you are defensive with regards to your community, and its loss. But honestly, there’s no anger in my bringing forth the conflicting tales presented here.

        • Sorry, but I think something is rotten inside this ‘community’, and I think Tomas was another victim of whatever sordid thing happened there. And I sincerely hope some outside authorities are brought it.

          Who typically carries tazers? And what reason might Tomas have had for running from the police? Maybe because he had just witnessed them tazing and stabbing people?

      • if you only knew

        Having crossed the threshold into madness during an arguement and having watched someone else do it too, you go into shock. You are not you. You are a lunatic. Doesn’t mean you are that in your soul. doesnt’ mean you can’t come back. But if you go to far, you lose touch, your soul fragments. Trust me on this. You never want to know from personal experiences. So if he was the kind loving person you say he was, fine, he was. But something happened and he lost control, lost touch with himself. Poor soul. The horror of going to the dark side. I have compassion for everyone involved, including him. I pray for healing for everyone.
        My thoughts to Kettenpom. Kudos to the first responders and to the store, a place of refuge.

  • Has the suspect’s family identified him yet?

    • According to KRCR tv, “Kettenpom residents Norma and Jim Gund, the couple that survived the stabbing attack Sunday, have identified Tomas Pitagoras Gouverneur as the suspect in the assault.”

  • Has the suspect’s family identified him yet?

    • According to KRCR tv, “Kettenpom residents Norma and Jim Gund, the couple that survived the stabbing attack Sunday, have identified Tomas Pitagoras Gouverneur as the suspect in the assault.”

  • I must add my voice to say that the Mas I knew would never, ever in a million years do something like this. And I had nothing but deep respect love and admiration for him. Based on what I’ve read, it is still entirely feasible that Mas was framed and possibly killed himself.

  • I must add my voice to say that the Mas I knew would never, ever in a million years do something like this. And I had nothing but deep respect love and admiration for him. Based on what I’ve read, it is still entirely feasible that Mas was framed and possibly killed himself.

  • This is a shocking and horrible event. I am heartsick for the victims and their families.

    Unfortunately, we only have the little information available, and I am afraid we may not get the answers to our questions. As shocking and hard as it is to believe, please let’s not further victimize the injured and deceased, nor point blame at those who have suffered. For those who knew Tomas, I know this story is impossible to comprehend but, let there be some compassion for all of the victims and those who love them. Until and unless we get more information, let’s hope that there is a way we can make sense of all this and find some peace.

  • This is a shocking and horrible event. I am heartsick for the victims and their families.

    Unfortunately, we only have the little information available, and I am afraid we may not get the answers to our questions. As shocking and hard as it is to believe, please let’s not further victimize the injured and deceased, nor point blame at those who have suffered. For those who knew Tomas, I know this story is impossible to comprehend but, let there be some compassion for all of the victims and those who love them. Until and unless we get more information, let’s hope that there is a way we can make sense of all this and find some peace.

  • So the killer was seen with another person in the same car two weeks before in the area, something to do with a fallen tree? Well then this would PROVE Tomas is not your killer, since HE was actually on the East Coast two weeks ago, visiting family, and road tripped it back to Oregon. There would be countless witnesses, photographs and receipts to support this. There’s definitely something fishy going on here. The facts just don’t add up, not to mention that Mas was a super gentle giant. My condolences to all the victims. It just could NOT have been Mas. Let’s wait and see what the autopsy report shows.

    • TY JJ

      Beyond the road trip documentation a time line will help fill some of the holes in this story, and the release of the 911 tape. It will be interesting to see if Mas had any taser burns or injuries not caused by the accident trauma.

    • Kettenpom Store

      As far as the sighting a week or so ago with the downed tree in the road. I know who said that. I saw them say it. They were not sure and it will not be good evidence to support anything because the person “thought” they “may” have seen a car like that but couldn’t say for sure.
      The first victim to arrive at my store gave me some indication of the attackers size. I am not tall and she held her hand out lower than me. You guys keep saying gentle giant… I agree it seems as if there is something else going on here. I am wondering about two people with the same name. Stolen identity… What is going on?

    • fromKettenpomInHawaii

      read my latest post ——I would like to apologise as I should have chosen my words a little more carefully. My brother and sister in law live in this area and lkike I have mentioned before, everybody does know everybody by first name in ythis small secluded community. When the people were seen on the road my brother and sis in law knew they were not from this area, and the plates on the car they seen were out of state plates. Is it possable that another car matching the description of the car “mas” was driving with out of state plates is the car my brother saw on the road? yes it is possable. Is it possable that the driver of that car on the road that day matched the description of “mas”? Yes it is possable. Is my brother SURE who he and my sis an law saw on that road that day WAS “THE MURDERER”? NO
      We ARE sure that the people they saw were NOT from zenia/kettenpom, and there were TWO people in that car. The driver of that car that day wouldnt even look at my sis in law when she told them they were trying to help by moving the tree so they could get through. The passenger made eye contact and said ok. Then like I said without another word sped by when he(brother) was able to move it just enough for them to get through. After they drove off my brother continued to move the tree out of the road and proceeded when he thought it was safe for everybody. The people were suspicious to him and he remembered this event because it was out of the ordinary. Again, are all of the the questions I asked “Possable”? Yes——–

      Why was tomas in trinity county if on his way back to oregon from the east coast? MILES off of a major highway. completely out of his way. I think there is more to this story than we will EVER know because the two people who could answer these questions are gone. Most of the people in the community would like to believe there is another person out there somewhere who could answer these questions, is it POSSABLE? YES

  • So the killer was seen with another person in the same car two weeks before in the area, something to do with a fallen tree? Well then this would PROVE Tomas is not your killer, since HE was actually on the East Coast two weeks ago, visiting family, and road tripped it back to Oregon. There would be countless witnesses, photographs and receipts to support this. There’s definitely something fishy going on here. The facts just don’t add up, not to mention that Mas was a super gentle giant. My condolences to all the victims. It just could NOT have been Mas. Let’s wait and see what the autopsy report shows.

    • TY JJ

      Beyond the road trip documentation a time line will help fill some of the holes in this story, and the release of the 911 tape. It will be interesting to see if Mas had any taser burns or injuries not caused by the accident trauma.

    • Kettenpom Store

      As far as the sighting a week or so ago with the downed tree in the road. I know who said that. I saw them say it. They were not sure and it will not be good evidence to support anything because the person “thought” they “may” have seen a car like that but couldn’t say for sure.
      The first victim to arrive at my store gave me some indication of the attackers size. I am not tall and she held her hand out lower than me. You guys keep saying gentle giant… I agree it seems as if there is something else going on here. I am wondering about two people with the same name. Stolen identity… What is going on?

    • fromKettenpomInHawaii

      read my latest post ——I would like to apologise as I should have chosen my words a little more carefully. My brother and sister in law live in this area and lkike I have mentioned before, everybody does know everybody by first name in ythis small secluded community. When the people were seen on the road my brother and sis in law knew they were not from this area, and the plates on the car they seen were out of state plates. Is it possable that another car matching the description of the car “mas” was driving with out of state plates is the car my brother saw on the road? yes it is possable. Is it possable that the driver of that car on the road that day matched the description of “mas”? Yes it is possable. Is my brother SURE who he and my sis an law saw on that road that day WAS “THE MURDERER”? NO
      We ARE sure that the people they saw were NOT from zenia/kettenpom, and there were TWO people in that car. The driver of that car that day wouldnt even look at my sis in law when she told them they were trying to help by moving the tree so they could get through. The passenger made eye contact and said ok. Then like I said without another word sped by when he(brother) was able to move it just enough for them to get through. After they drove off my brother continued to move the tree out of the road and proceeded when he thought it was safe for everybody. The people were suspicious to him and he remembered this event because it was out of the ordinary. Again, are all of the the questions I asked “Possable”? Yes——–

      Why was tomas in trinity county if on his way back to oregon from the east coast? MILES off of a major highway. completely out of his way. I think there is more to this story than we will EVER know because the two people who could answer these questions are gone. Most of the people in the community would like to believe there is another person out there somewhere who could answer these questions, is it POSSABLE? YES

  • steve huzbanknor

    Does anyone know the names of the victims?

    • I have heard the first names but not the last. I’m hesitant to give the man’s as it is fairly unusual and the family may not have all been notified. The woman’s name is said to be Christine or Christina. I give that because of the rumors which may be unfounded that say she was Tomas’ exgirlfriend. I thought that possibly this might help them place her in their mind if he did indeed know her before.

  • steve huzbanknor

    Does anyone know the names of the victims?

    • I have heard the first names but not the last. I’m hesitant to give the man’s as it is fairly unusual and the family may not have all been notified. The woman’s name is said to be Christine or Christina. I give that because of the rumors which may be unfounded that say she was Tomas’ exgirlfriend. I thought that possibly this might help them place her in their mind if he did indeed know her before.

  • Mas was well over 6 feet tall, probably 6’5″, 250 lbs.

    Did the male victim’s name end in a Y?

  • Mas was well over 6 feet tall, probably 6’5″, 250 lbs.

    Did the male victim’s name end in a Y?

  • I just want to add my voice to the chorus of people saying there is no way in hell Tomas stabbed anybody. He was a sweet and gentle soul. And no, sweet and gentle people don’t go on stabbing sprees.

    I know that every murderer has a mother who thinks he’s a beautiful spirit, but in this case, you would be hard pressed to find anyone who ever knew him who thought he could harm a mouse. That just doesn’t happen.

    Instead of insisting that the huge circle of people who knew and loved him must be wrong, maybe you should be examining the stories of witnesses and victims more closely, because something is fishy here, and you still have a murderer in your midst. It’s easy to just pin something on a dead man that can’t defend themselves…

    Also, I can corroborate that Tomas was in Atlanta recently, so he wasn’t around for any tree-moving. Is it a case of mistaken identity? Well, his fiancee thinks he’s dead, so if this Tomas isn’t our Tomas, then the one we know is missing.

  • I just want to add my voice to the chorus of people saying there is no way in hell Tomas stabbed anybody. He was a sweet and gentle soul. And no, sweet and gentle people don’t go on stabbing sprees.

    I know that every murderer has a mother who thinks he’s a beautiful spirit, but in this case, you would be hard pressed to find anyone who ever knew him who thought he could harm a mouse. That just doesn’t happen.

    Instead of insisting that the huge circle of people who knew and loved him must be wrong, maybe you should be examining the stories of witnesses and victims more closely, because something is fishy here, and you still have a murderer in your midst. It’s easy to just pin something on a dead man that can’t defend themselves…

    Also, I can corroborate that Tomas was in Atlanta recently, so he wasn’t around for any tree-moving. Is it a case of mistaken identity? Well, his fiancee thinks he’s dead, so if this Tomas isn’t our Tomas, then the one we know is missing.

  • I’m going to assume that the police and paper did their work correctly and that the body id matches, plates on car, matches visual confirmation of suspect. That said, people in trauma don’t always remember things accurately and I would not be surprised if this SUSPECT was simply at the wrong place at the wrong time. It very well could be possible that someone else was at the house and that Mas fled from fear, not from guilt. It saddens me that we will never know, that in his death, we lose answers for everyone involved. It also saddens me that in grief people are quick to point fingers at one individual and are happy to condemn him. I understand a community needs closure, but I also have known the ‘Mas described by others on this feed.

    It’s not an exaggeration to say that Mas (Tomas) was known for his hugs, his amazing smile, and his outgoing and warm personality. Please see the below link for local reporting on this matter. My heart and my condolences go out to everyone involved in this event.

    http://gazettetimes.com/news/local/article_4c3c4c32-504e-11e0-98b8-001cc4c03286.html

    • “That said, people in trauma don’t always remember things accurately and I would not be surprised if this SUSPECT was simply at the wrong place at the wrong time.”

      I agree on that sentiment. Especially since the victims / witnesses / store employees apparently had hours until police arrived, talked to numerous people, etc. Things like this have been proven to alter your memory, especially when involved in a trauma. Things as simples as switching an “a” for a “the” (as in “did you see a broken window / did you see the broken window”) can change a witness’ memory of the events.

  • I’m going to assume that the police and paper did their work correctly and that the body id matches, plates on car, matches visual confirmation of suspect. That said, people in trauma don’t always remember things accurately and I would not be surprised if this SUSPECT was simply at the wrong place at the wrong time. It very well could be possible that someone else was at the house and that Mas fled from fear, not from guilt. It saddens me that we will never know, that in his death, we lose answers for everyone involved. It also saddens me that in grief people are quick to point fingers at one individual and are happy to condemn him. I understand a community needs closure, but I also have known the ‘Mas described by others on this feed.

    It’s not an exaggeration to say that Mas (Tomas) was known for his hugs, his amazing smile, and his outgoing and warm personality. Please see the below link for local reporting on this matter. My heart and my condolences go out to everyone involved in this event.

    http://gazettetimes.com/news/local/article_4c3c4c32-504e-11e0-98b8-001cc4c03286.html

    • “That said, people in trauma don’t always remember things accurately and I would not be surprised if this SUSPECT was simply at the wrong place at the wrong time.”

      I agree on that sentiment. Especially since the victims / witnesses / store employees apparently had hours until police arrived, talked to numerous people, etc. Things like this have been proven to alter your memory, especially when involved in a trauma. Things as simples as switching an “a” for a “the” (as in “did you see a broken window / did you see the broken window”) can change a witness’ memory of the events.

  • I hope there will be an investigation of this and that it is thorough. This could shed some useful light to the situation. Although many people in the area perhaps do not encourage law enforcement to take an active role, this is something that could possibly just haunt the wrong family and loved ones forever if the truth does not come out. If the witnesses are that convinced Mas was the killer, I sure hope that everyone involved down there shares all the facts of the situation without feeling the need to alter the story. If there is anyone involved with the situation that does not see everything line up, I beg of you to not bury those details, let them be known!

  • I hope there will be an investigation of this and that it is thorough. This could shed some useful light to the situation. Although many people in the area perhaps do not encourage law enforcement to take an active role, this is something that could possibly just haunt the wrong family and loved ones forever if the truth does not come out. If the witnesses are that convinced Mas was the killer, I sure hope that everyone involved down there shares all the facts of the situation without feeling the need to alter the story. If there is anyone involved with the situation that does not see everything line up, I beg of you to not bury those details, let them be known!

  • I’ve seen comments in here from Tomas’ supporters saying the victim claims to have been tazed 20 times, but I can’t find any account of that other than anonymous comments. All the officials reports say is that a stun gun may have been used.

    • Frank this is a quote from Mr. Gunds daughter, “My father had heard [the] commotion. [He] ran to check and through the window saw Tomas slitting Norma’s throat. As my father (Jim) went through the door, he was hit in the face with a tazzer gun, and began to fight for his life. His throat, too, was slashed and he was hit over 20 times with a tazzer gun.”

      Of course LE doesn’t report a taser being found.

      • But did the police chasing Tomas have tasers?

      • Sounds like the hearsay account from his daughter could just mean that he beat with the taser, not shocked with one.

        • Both of the surviving victims were tasered. They had wounds to their face from the hooks lodging into their faces. I saw the wounds myself.
          Jim also said he was tasered on his spine. I am not sure if twenty times is an exaggeration or not. I only saw him with his clothes on. But I know he was hit with a Taser multiple times.

  • I’ve seen comments in here from Tomas’ supporters saying the victim claims to have been tazed 20 times, but I can’t find any account of that other than anonymous comments. All the officials reports say is that a stun gun may have been used.

    • Frank this is a quote from Mr. Gunds daughter, “My father had heard [the] commotion. [He] ran to check and through the window saw Tomas slitting Norma’s throat. As my father (Jim) went through the door, he was hit in the face with a tazzer gun, and began to fight for his life. His throat, too, was slashed and he was hit over 20 times with a tazzer gun.”

      Of course LE doesn’t report a taser being found.

      • But did the police chasing Tomas have tasers?

      • Sounds like the hearsay account from his daughter could just mean that he beat with the taser, not shocked with one.

        • Both of the surviving victims were tasered. They had wounds to their face from the hooks lodging into their faces. I saw the wounds myself.
          Jim also said he was tasered on his spine. I am not sure if twenty times is an exaggeration or not. I only saw him with his clothes on. But I know he was hit with a Taser multiple times.

  • Friend of a Friend

    I’m concerned that there are reports that Mas’ body has already been cremated? Any hope of getting some due diligence reports from local law officials? Did anyone other than a witness make a positive ID? What the heck is going on out there?

  • Friend of a Friend

    I’m concerned that there are reports that Mas’ body has already been cremated? Any hope of getting some due diligence reports from local law officials? Did anyone other than a witness make a positive ID? What the heck is going on out there?

  • I am family of one of the victim here. I just got notified last night that my sister got murdered. What happened??? I hope they are not going to close the investigation right away because that suspect guy died. I agree there is something fishy here. Maybe we will be able to find out more info from those two witnesses later. My sister was a very kind and great heart. I do not think it is fair at all that her beautiful life ended this way. I need some justice and evidence for her.

    • Pimjai, I am so sorry for your pain. I hope you find what you are looking for!

    • Well liked in the area.

      May I ask your sisters name and her relation, if any, to Mas? Also, is she an Oregonian? My sympathy goes to you and your family.

    • As someone who was friends with the other two who are dead, i know this is horrible and so frustrating to see the conflicting and incomplete stories . Internet news often lack by lines and accountability anymore and that leaves us confused and hurt.

      My heart goes out to you, this is a time of great loss and we must stay strong together.

      Do you know if there is any truth to Christine having been an ex girlfriend to Mas?
      I find thus “coincidence” very strange as I knew the two men for years.

  • I am family of one of the victim here. I just got notified last night that my sister got murdered. What happened??? I hope they are not going to close the investigation right away because that suspect guy died. I agree there is something fishy here. Maybe we will be able to find out more info from those two witnesses later. My sister was a very kind and great heart. I do not think it is fair at all that her beautiful life ended this way. I need some justice and evidence for her.

    • Pimjai, I am so sorry for your pain. I hope you find what you are looking for!

    • Well liked in the area.

      May I ask your sisters name and her relation, if any, to Mas? Also, is she an Oregonian? My sympathy goes to you and your family.

    • As someone who was friends with the other two who are dead, i know this is horrible and so frustrating to see the conflicting and incomplete stories . Internet news often lack by lines and accountability anymore and that leaves us confused and hurt.

      My heart goes out to you, this is a time of great loss and we must stay strong together.

      Do you know if there is any truth to Christine having been an ex girlfriend to Mas?
      I find thus “coincidence” very strange as I knew the two men for years.

  • UPDATE: I have just posted a new summary of all the credible evidence here. Please let me know if you have other information in the comment section. I will amend as necessary.

  • UPDATE: I have just posted a new summary of all the credible evidence here. Please let me know if you have other information in the comment section. I will amend as necessary.

  • My heart goes out to all of the friends and family involved in this horrendous crime. I am however a very old and dear friend of Tomas and like others have said, I simply cannot believe he could do this. I understand that people can become detached and do/commit acts that defy their personal beings but this just doesn’t make sense. He was in NYC just a few weeks ago on his road trip and I spoke with him at length about how wonderful his life is at that moment. He was ecstatic about his soon to be wife, he was pushing himself to get in shape and was planning on running in a marathon, saving up to buy new instruments and generally looking forward to the rest of his life. Tomas was a BIG man but he never used his size for anything but good deeds. I have never even seen him get angry, and I’ve personally given him reason to! Tomas was one of the most open minded and gentle hearted people I have been blessed to know in this life. He was a passivist and believed that violence was never a way to settle anything.

    I really want to see what a thorough investigation will turn up.

    Again my heart goes out to all of the victims and families involved, I just want to know what happened so I can settle the memory of (in my mind and experience) a dear friend and a great man. Please forgive me if my comments are hard for some of you.

  • My heart goes out to all of the friends and family involved in this horrendous crime. I am however a very old and dear friend of Tomas and like others have said, I simply cannot believe he could do this. I understand that people can become detached and do/commit acts that defy their personal beings but this just doesn’t make sense. He was in NYC just a few weeks ago on his road trip and I spoke with him at length about how wonderful his life is at that moment. He was ecstatic about his soon to be wife, he was pushing himself to get in shape and was planning on running in a marathon, saving up to buy new instruments and generally looking forward to the rest of his life. Tomas was a BIG man but he never used his size for anything but good deeds. I have never even seen him get angry, and I’ve personally given him reason to! Tomas was one of the most open minded and gentle hearted people I have been blessed to know in this life. He was a passivist and believed that violence was never a way to settle anything.

    I really want to see what a thorough investigation will turn up.

    Again my heart goes out to all of the victims and families involved, I just want to know what happened so I can settle the memory of (in my mind and experience) a dear friend and a great man. Please forgive me if my comments are hard for some of you.

  • UPDATE/CORRECTION

    The woman who was killed was not an ex-girlfriend of Tomas Pitagoras Gouverneur, Jenna Summer Smith told the Gazette-Times on Thursday.

  • UPDATE/CORRECTION

    The woman who was killed was not an ex-girlfriend of Tomas Pitagoras Gouverneur, Jenna Summer Smith told the Gazette-Times on Thursday.

  • An old ex and friend of tomas

    No new news as of today? I hope this doesn’t just fade away. We want to know what really happened.

  • An old ex and friend of tomas

    No new news as of today? I hope this doesn’t just fade away. We want to know what really happened.

  • Someone offered some photos of Kristine Constantino and I have made a memory page of her for those who would like to share memories and photos. You could upload the photos to photobucket and put the link in the comments or you can send them to me. mskymkemp@gmail.com

  • Someone offered some photos of Kristine Constantino and I have made a memory page of her for those who would like to share memories and photos. You could upload the photos to photobucket and put the link in the comments or you can send them to me. mskymkemp@gmail.com

  • Pingback: The Kettenpom Double Homicide: How to Follow the Unfolding Story « REDHEADED BLACKBELT

  • Pingback: The Kettenpom Double Homicide: How to Follow the Unfolding Story « REDHEADED BLACKBELT

  • My prayers to the families and community. There is a lot of speculation going on, and not a lot of concrete facts yet. The info will come out…it just takes time. Waiting can be so hard…but what happened will come out. I hope this community will continue to stick together and help each other though this horrible time.

  • My prayers to the families and community. There is a lot of speculation going on, and not a lot of concrete facts yet. The info will come out…it just takes time. Waiting can be so hard…but what happened will come out. I hope this community will continue to stick together and help each other though this horrible time.

  • fromKettenpomInHawaii

    I check this site every morning and several times a day to see if there are any updates. There havnt been any for a while. I just want to know how all of the families are doing and if the gunds are ok. Like I posted before, I grew up just a min or two from where this crime took place and the gunds are friends of my family. Thank You Kym for all your hard work and dedication. I think what you do here is great and helpfull for everyone who feels the loss from this tragedy. if you have any questions about the community or the people in this isolated but WONDERFUL place please feel free to contact me.

  • fromKettenpomInHawaii

    I check this site every morning and several times a day to see if there are any updates. There havnt been any for a while. I just want to know how all of the families are doing and if the gunds are ok. Like I posted before, I grew up just a min or two from where this crime took place and the gunds are friends of my family. Thank You Kym for all your hard work and dedication. I think what you do here is great and helpfull for everyone who feels the loss from this tragedy. if you have any questions about the community or the people in this isolated but WONDERFUL place please feel free to contact me.

  • Have there been anymore updates?

    • Not to the best of my knowledge. Sorry, I ‘m sure everyone is hoping for clarity but I haven’t seen any more information.

    • There won’t be any more, except hopefully for one saying that Norma Gund is feeling better and home from the hospital. The police aren’t interviewing anybody. They’ve already decided to declare drugs the motive, even though it doesn’t make a lot of sense according to the actual facts (that’s why you haven’t heard them say how much drugs and money was in the car–they know if it were public what paltry amounts were involved, people would buy the robbery line).

      Autopsy reports will probably come out that showed that everyone involved smoked pot. And that Kris and Sky died of being stabbed, and that Tomas died of blunt force trauma to the head. That’s all we’re ever going to know.

      Open-shut. The police were happy to be able to pin it on a dead man, which is why they designed the identification of Tomas to so highly bias it against him (it would never have held up in court; you need to show arrays, not show someone and then say ‘This is who did it. Can you confirm that?’).

      • If Mas hadn’t died, in the end he would have ended up confessing. This dude snapped. Everyone knows it. Quit grasping at a conspiracy that just isn’t there.

        • I have some familiarity with psychotic breaks. They don’t happen out of nowhere–they happen slowly, over a period of weeks or months. People don’t wake up completely normal and then suddenly snap out of nowhere. I know a lot of locals just want to say it’s solved and walk away, and ignore everything that doesn’t make sense.

          No, ‘everyone’ doesn’t know it. But enough locals are happy to pin it on a dead outsider, so it’s no going to be investigated any further. You insist and insist, but in the end, it’s your fault if a guilty person goes free, for being so incurious, for being so credulous and willing to accept a story that doesn’t make any sense.

          • Why in the world do you say the story doesn’t make sense? Mas worked with these two. There was a 911 call from the woman’s phone BEFORE the Gunds even entered the picture. The couple arrived at the house to be attacked by Mas, who hastily fled the scene and was chased by the police before crashing his car and dying.

            Tragic all around, but why in the world do you think the story doesn’t add up? The only slight changes in police accounts regard what exactly the Gunds were told after the 911 call. 1st account said they were asked to check on the victims; second account said dispatchers were “under the impression” the Gunds could see the home from their home and were told not to go directly to the house.

            In the end, what the Gunds were told is irrelevant to the brutal murders of Sky and Kristine. It’s just CYA stuff from the sheriff’s officials fearing a lawsuit from the Gunds. It has nothing to do with Mas.

            Though we’ll never know what words were exchanged between mas and his victims, the general narrative of the murders adds up completely. Just because you knew the killer and can’t believe he did it doesn’t mean the official accounts of what happened don’t add up, it simply means you’re having a hard time picturing Mas doing this. But at least two others have posted on here that they knew the guy and had one misunderstanding, and he was never the same with him. See? Even people who do know Mas say this wasn’t totally outlandish. Also, to call Mas a close, dear friend of his victims would be a mistake. Those two had lifelong friends, and Mas was not one of them.

            I understand that Mas had friends and very good moments, but I am honestly curious as to why you don’t think the story adds up.

  • Have there been anymore updates?

    • Not to the best of my knowledge. Sorry, I ‘m sure everyone is hoping for clarity but I haven’t seen any more information.

    • There won’t be any more, except hopefully for one saying that Norma Gund is feeling better and home from the hospital. The police aren’t interviewing anybody. They’ve already decided to declare drugs the motive, even though it doesn’t make a lot of sense according to the actual facts (that’s why you haven’t heard them say how much drugs and money was in the car–they know if it were public what paltry amounts were involved, people would buy the robbery line).

      Autopsy reports will probably come out that showed that everyone involved smoked pot. And that Kris and Sky died of being stabbed, and that Tomas died of blunt force trauma to the head. That’s all we’re ever going to know.

      Open-shut. The police were happy to be able to pin it on a dead man, which is why they designed the identification of Tomas to so highly bias it against him (it would never have held up in court; you need to show arrays, not show someone and then say ‘This is who did it. Can you confirm that?’).

      • If Mas hadn’t died, in the end he would have ended up confessing. This dude snapped. Everyone knows it. Quit grasping at a conspiracy that just isn’t there.

        • I have some familiarity with psychotic breaks. They don’t happen out of nowhere–they happen slowly, over a period of weeks or months. People don’t wake up completely normal and then suddenly snap out of nowhere. I know a lot of locals just want to say it’s solved and walk away, and ignore everything that doesn’t make sense.

          No, ‘everyone’ doesn’t know it. But enough locals are happy to pin it on a dead outsider, so it’s no going to be investigated any further. You insist and insist, but in the end, it’s your fault if a guilty person goes free, for being so incurious, for being so credulous and willing to accept a story that doesn’t make any sense.

          • Why in the world do you say the story doesn’t make sense? Mas worked with these two. There was a 911 call from the woman’s phone BEFORE the Gunds even entered the picture. The couple arrived at the house to be attacked by Mas, who hastily fled the scene and was chased by the police before crashing his car and dying.

            Tragic all around, but why in the world do you think the story doesn’t add up? The only slight changes in police accounts regard what exactly the Gunds were told after the 911 call. 1st account said they were asked to check on the victims; second account said dispatchers were “under the impression” the Gunds could see the home from their home and were told not to go directly to the house.

            In the end, what the Gunds were told is irrelevant to the brutal murders of Sky and Kristine. It’s just CYA stuff from the sheriff’s officials fearing a lawsuit from the Gunds. It has nothing to do with Mas.

            Though we’ll never know what words were exchanged between mas and his victims, the general narrative of the murders adds up completely. Just because you knew the killer and can’t believe he did it doesn’t mean the official accounts of what happened don’t add up, it simply means you’re having a hard time picturing Mas doing this. But at least two others have posted on here that they knew the guy and had one misunderstanding, and he was never the same with him. See? Even people who do know Mas say this wasn’t totally outlandish. Also, to call Mas a close, dear friend of his victims would be a mistake. Those two had lifelong friends, and Mas was not one of them.

            I understand that Mas had friends and very good moments, but I am honestly curious as to why you don’t think the story adds up.

  • What is that evidence?

  • What is that evidence?

  • fromKettenpomInHawaii

    It’s sad that no one will ever know exactly what happend in that house or why. What we do know is that the male survivor fought back. He was able to cause injuries to his attacker. Specific wounds in specific areas would have been found on the body of the attacker and would match the description given to the authorities by the male survivor. This would place the attacker at the house, not to mention biological evidence would be found on the attacker, on the victims, in or around the house, and in the all of the vehicles involved. If those injuries matched the statement given by the male victim, unfortunately the person killed in a high speed chase while fleeing was the attacker. It would be very difficult (almost impossable) to stage injuries on another person before they died after they fled, not to mention stage dna/biological evidence in or around a house and several vehicles(one in the possession of a man involved in a high speed chase). I will not reveal my source, but there should have been a piece of the attacker found at the scene because one of the survivors was able to take a bite out of the attacker. This leaves the attackers dna at the scene, on the victim, and in the vehicles. (note) this is hearsay
    But even if he didn’t take a bite out of him, ( I believe my source) the survivor was fighting for his life. He would use any means available to survive. nails, teeth, fist, etc. The attackers DNA had to have been found on the victim(s), this along with the positive ID and the body (with specific wounds) would be all the evidence needed by the authorities to close this investigation.
    In short if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, it’s a duck.

    • I love how much faith people have that DNA tests are going to get done. I wish it were so, but DNA tests only get done if there’s a DA pushing it. There will be no tests. They don’t want to risk discovering anything that doesn’t point to the dead man. Police like closing cases more than they like solving them.

      • Like I thought, RT. You’ve got nothing.

      • Lay off the good citizens

        If all the truth comes out about the relationships between people residing in Summit OR where Mas and Sky were from, and the years of running pot they were involved in from California into Oregon from Humboldt, Trinity and Mendocino Counties, a rational person might conclude that this relationship evolved into nothing more than a greed driven tragedy.
        Now RT wants a scape goat, but is unwilling to accept the possibility that Mas and Sky’s relationship might not have been as it would appear from the surface. it is a real shame this innocent girl was cut short, but Mas and Sky knew just what they were doing. Money for Nothing. Neither had any visible means of support and Sky had 45 acres that was cleverly paid for with the profits of their enterprise.
        RT if you want to air dirty laundry regarding this enterprise these protagonists were involved in, I would be happy to share some additional facts.
        Watch to see who checks all the bank records for Sky after this settles to see where the paper trail leads.
        Why would a road trip be necessary unless to lay off the weight they were growing to the East Coast where it still commands $4000/Lb
        I know.
        Now RT shows no sign of yielding on these concocted notions, and if it continues until some other real facts come out, I will lay a few more facts on you that may really hit below the belt.
        Stop throwing stones at everyone

        • Lay Off, I understand your frustration but when you’re fighting fire with fire, please try and remember that you may be burning Sky’s family or other innocent victims who have offered nothing but sympathy to the Gunds.

        • There sure does seem to be a lot of hostility toward outsiders who come into the Emerald Triangle to grow pot.

          A lot more hostility than was evidenced between Mas and Sky, who appeared to be making money together. The fact that they were making money together would be a reason for Mas NOT to kill Sky, would it not?

      • fromKettenpomInHawaii

        If you think the authorities are not going to do everything they can to assure the public that the driver of the car and the man who commited these murders are one in the same, you are wrong. The families of the victims and the two people who faught for their lives deserve to know the truth. These people deserve to know that this man is not going to come back for them and finish what he started. I am confident the investigators are going to use all the resources available to them to assure the innocent people involved in this horrific event that they are safe and the murderer is never going to hurt them again.
        The victims are great, hardworking, honest folks whos only mistake in this whole mess was to try to help a neighbor in need. Im sure if they could do it all over again the only thing they would change is they would bring a weapon along with them and avoid being injured. But they would walk down that same road and walk in that house just the same as they did that day because that is the kind of poeple they are. People like that are few and far between and I am honored to know them. They are both doing WONDERFUL by the way!!!

        • Thank you for that update. I am so glad. Please pass on that if they ever need a new neighborhood, people here think they would be great neighbors.

        • The investigators are not returning the family members’ phone calls. last I heard. There is also zero evidence that they have done any ‘investigating’ at all.

          You are naive about how law enforcement works.

  • fromKettenpomInHawaii

    It’s sad that no one will ever know exactly what happend in that house or why. What we do know is that the male survivor fought back. He was able to cause injuries to his attacker. Specific wounds in specific areas would have been found on the body of the attacker and would match the description given to the authorities by the male survivor. This would place the attacker at the house, not to mention biological evidence would be found on the attacker, on the victims, in or around the house, and in the all of the vehicles involved. If those injuries matched the statement given by the male victim, unfortunately the person killed in a high speed chase while fleeing was the attacker. It would be very difficult (almost impossable) to stage injuries on another person before they died after they fled, not to mention stage dna/biological evidence in or around a house and several vehicles(one in the possession of a man involved in a high speed chase). I will not reveal my source, but there should have been a piece of the attacker found at the scene because one of the survivors was able to take a bite out of the attacker. This leaves the attackers dna at the scene, on the victim, and in the vehicles. (note) this is hearsay
    But even if he didn’t take a bite out of him, ( I believe my source) the survivor was fighting for his life. He would use any means available to survive. nails, teeth, fist, etc. The attackers DNA had to have been found on the victim(s), this along with the positive ID and the body (with specific wounds) would be all the evidence needed by the authorities to close this investigation.
    In short if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, it’s a duck.

    • I love how much faith people have that DNA tests are going to get done. I wish it were so, but DNA tests only get done if there’s a DA pushing it. There will be no tests. They don’t want to risk discovering anything that doesn’t point to the dead man. Police like closing cases more than they like solving them.

      • Like I thought, RT. You’ve got nothing.

      • Lay off the good citizens

        If all the truth comes out about the relationships between people residing in Summit OR where Mas and Sky were from, and the years of running pot they were involved in from California into Oregon from Humboldt, Trinity and Mendocino Counties, a rational person might conclude that this relationship evolved into nothing more than a greed driven tragedy.
        Now RT wants a scape goat, but is unwilling to accept the possibility that Mas and Sky’s relationship might not have been as it would appear from the surface. it is a real shame this innocent girl was cut short, but Mas and Sky knew just what they were doing. Money for Nothing. Neither had any visible means of support and Sky had 45 acres that was cleverly paid for with the profits of their enterprise.
        RT if you want to air dirty laundry regarding this enterprise these protagonists were involved in, I would be happy to share some additional facts.
        Watch to see who checks all the bank records for Sky after this settles to see where the paper trail leads.
        Why would a road trip be necessary unless to lay off the weight they were growing to the East Coast where it still commands $4000/Lb
        I know.
        Now RT shows no sign of yielding on these concocted notions, and if it continues until some other real facts come out, I will lay a few more facts on you that may really hit below the belt.
        Stop throwing stones at everyone

        • Lay Off, I understand your frustration but when you’re fighting fire with fire, please try and remember that you may be burning Sky’s family or other innocent victims who have offered nothing but sympathy to the Gunds.

        • There sure does seem to be a lot of hostility toward outsiders who come into the Emerald Triangle to grow pot.

          A lot more hostility than was evidenced between Mas and Sky, who appeared to be making money together. The fact that they were making money together would be a reason for Mas NOT to kill Sky, would it not?

      • fromKettenpomInHawaii

        If you think the authorities are not going to do everything they can to assure the public that the driver of the car and the man who commited these murders are one in the same, you are wrong. The families of the victims and the two people who faught for their lives deserve to know the truth. These people deserve to know that this man is not going to come back for them and finish what he started. I am confident the investigators are going to use all the resources available to them to assure the innocent people involved in this horrific event that they are safe and the murderer is never going to hurt them again.
        The victims are great, hardworking, honest folks whos only mistake in this whole mess was to try to help a neighbor in need. Im sure if they could do it all over again the only thing they would change is they would bring a weapon along with them and avoid being injured. But they would walk down that same road and walk in that house just the same as they did that day because that is the kind of poeple they are. People like that are few and far between and I am honored to know them. They are both doing WONDERFUL by the way!!!

        • Thank you for that update. I am so glad. Please pass on that if they ever need a new neighborhood, people here think they would be great neighbors.

        • The investigators are not returning the family members’ phone calls. last I heard. There is also zero evidence that they have done any ‘investigating’ at all.

          You are naive about how law enforcement works.

  • any more info?…hard to believe that the police have nothing more they can release.

    • fromKettenpomInHawaii

      The victims are recovering as well as can be expected concidering what they have been through.

      • who said anything about them?…just wondering if the police have released any toxicology or autopsy reports

        • fromKettenpomInHawaii

          $%& I did!!!… “them” are friends of mine and I think you are being rude and inconsiderate. Apologies if I misunderstood your comment but I dont think I did.
          $%& If the police had released any of that information I am confident Kim would have posted a link. You odviously have internet access why dont you do some research.

          • wow…firstly, you did misunderstand my comment. As for being rude & inconsiderate, I think you could give lessons. I was not asking about anything having to do with victim statements. I was simply asking if anybody had heard anything new. As for having a computer & researching myself, there is a recent article released that I do not have access to because I am not a subscriber. As it is a local paper, I thought somebody local might have read it. Don’t be so quick to take offense and be rude in return.

            • Thanks to a very kind reader who bought me a subscription to the Trinity Journal, I read the article. It did a very nice recap and mentioned that Police were still checking saying, “state Department of Justice is processing evidence, including blood samples and prints, and that will take time…

            • fromKettenpomInHawaii

              Ok Here is your first lesson. I dont care for you or your “comments”. There are people following this thread that want to know how our friends are doing. end of lesson.

              • Kettenpom in Hawaii and $%&, ,

                Hey you guys, there is so much pain and anger coming out of this, please try to kindly remind someone to be polite and then try to help them. There is no sense letting the horror of what happened spread a ripple of anger and despair outwards. Sometimes venting to a friend helps before working hard to politely respond online.

  • any more info?…hard to believe that the police have nothing more they can release.

    • fromKettenpomInHawaii

      The victims are recovering as well as can be expected concidering what they have been through.

      • who said anything about them?…just wondering if the police have released any toxicology or autopsy reports

        • fromKettenpomInHawaii

          $%& I did!!!… “them” are friends of mine and I think you are being rude and inconsiderate. Apologies if I misunderstood your comment but I dont think I did.
          $%& If the police had released any of that information I am confident Kim would have posted a link. You odviously have internet access why dont you do some research.

          • wow…firstly, you did misunderstand my comment. As for being rude & inconsiderate, I think you could give lessons. I was not asking about anything having to do with victim statements. I was simply asking if anybody had heard anything new. As for having a computer & researching myself, there is a recent article released that I do not have access to because I am not a subscriber. As it is a local paper, I thought somebody local might have read it. Don’t be so quick to take offense and be rude in return.

            • Thanks to a very kind reader who bought me a subscription to the Trinity Journal, I read the article. It did a very nice recap and mentioned that Police were still checking saying, “state Department of Justice is processing evidence, including blood samples and prints, and that will take time…

            • fromKettenpomInHawaii

              Ok Here is your first lesson. I dont care for you or your “comments”. There are people following this thread that want to know how our friends are doing. end of lesson.

              • Kettenpom in Hawaii and $%&, ,

                Hey you guys, there is so much pain and anger coming out of this, please try to kindly remind someone to be polite and then try to help them. There is no sense letting the horror of what happened spread a ripple of anger and despair outwards. Sometimes venting to a friend helps before working hard to politely respond online.

  • I think RT is a guilty party,and keeps trying to implicate the Gunds to cover her tracks,she is obviously guilty of witholding evidence,at least.Or it could be one of her psycotic breaks

    • DT,
      I think RT was trying to make the point that it is as hard for RT to accept that Tomas is guilty as it is for the neighbors to accept that the Gunds had anything to do with harming the Kristine and Sky.

      I feel for the Gunds though. It must be tremendously hard to have gone through everything they have gone through and to have to deal with people scrutinizing their every choice. As far as I can see, they got brutally assaulted while attempting to act like good neighbors. My heart goes out to them. If there is ever a fund to help them deal with the financial consequences (not to mention the emotional) I would donate. I expect many people here would.

  • I think RT is a guilty party,and keeps trying to implicate the Gunds to cover her tracks,she is obviously guilty of witholding evidence,at least.Or it could be one of her psycotic breaks

    • DT,
      I think RT was trying to make the point that it is as hard for RT to accept that Tomas is guilty as it is for the neighbors to accept that the Gunds had anything to do with harming the Kristine and Sky.

      I feel for the Gunds though. It must be tremendously hard to have gone through everything they have gone through and to have to deal with people scrutinizing their every choice. As far as I can see, they got brutally assaulted while attempting to act like good neighbors. My heart goes out to them. If there is ever a fund to help them deal with the financial consequences (not to mention the emotional) I would donate. I expect many people here would.

Leave a Reply

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *